UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT

UNITED STATES BANKRUPTCY COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA FORT LAUDERDALE Case No. 09-34791-RBR Chapter 11 IN RE: ROTHSTEIN ROSENFELDT ADLER, P.A., Debtor VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE Corporate Representative of Fowler White Burnett, PA Friday, October 19th, 2018 10:05 a.m. - 2:29 p.m. 525 Okeechobee Boulevard, Suite 1200 West Palm Beach, FL 33401 Examination of the witness taken before Sonja D. Hall Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 1665 Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard, Suite 1001 West Palm Beach, FL 33401 (561) 471-2995 Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803632 L 1 2 3 4 APPEARANCES: For Jeffrey Epstein: LINK & ROCKENBACH, P.A. 1555 Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard, Suite West Palm Beach, FL 33401 301 By SCOTT J. LINK, ESQUIRE 5 By JENNIFER LETTMAN, ESQUIRE 6 For Bradley Edwards: 7 SEARCY, DENNEY, SCAROLA, BARNHART & 8 SHIPLEY, P.A. 2139 Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard 9 West Palm Beach, FL 33409 By JACK SCAROLA, ESQUIRE 10 For Farmer Jaffe: 11 EDWARDS POTTINGER LLC 12 425 N Andrews Avenue, Suite 2 Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301 13 By Bradley Edwards, Esquire 14 For Fowler White: 15 CARLTON FIELDS, PA 525 Okeechobee Boulevard, Suite 1200 16 West Palm Beach, FL 33401 By JOSEPH IANNO, JR, ESQUIRE 17 18 ALSO PRESENT 19 Above & Beyond Reprographics 2161 Palm Beach Lakes Boulevard, Suite 412 20 West Palm Beach, FL 33409 By Manuel Santiago, Videographer 21 22 23 24 25 Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803633 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 INDEX Videotaped Deposition of JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE Page No. Direct Examination by Mr. Scarola Cross-Examination by Mr. Edwards Cross-Examination by Mr. Link Redirect Examination by Mr. Scarola Recross-Examination by Mr. Link Further Redirect Examination by Mr. Scarola Recross-Examination by Mr. Edwards Certificate of Oath Certificate of Reporter Read & Sign Letter to Witness EXHIBIT INDEX 6 71 105 106 126 127 150 153 154 155 Letter Description Page No A Re-Notice of Taking Video Deposition 7 B Exhibit Numbered Documents 44 C Produced Subpoena Duces Tecum Documents 109 D Various Bates-Stamped Documents 143 (Sealed and retained by Mr. Scarola) Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803634 4 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We are on the video record. This is the 19th day of October 2018. The time is approximately 10:05 a.m. This is the videotaped deposition of the corporate representative of Fowler White Burnett, P.A., In Re: Rothstein Rosenfeldt Adler, PA. This deposition is being held at 525 Okeechobee Boulevard, West Palm Beach, FL 33401. My name is Manuel Santiago. I am the videographer representing Above & Beyond Reprographics. Will the attorneys please announce their appearances for the record? MR. SCAROLA: My name is Jack Scarola. I am counsel on behalf of Bradley Edwards. MR. EDWARDS: Brad Edwards on behalf of Farmer Jaffe. MR. IANNO: Joseph Ianno, Carlton Fields, on behalf of Fowler White. MR. LINK: Scott Link and let Jennifer Lettman on behalf of Mr. Epstein. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803635 5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THEREUPON, JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE, being a witness in the notice heretofore filed, and being first duly sworn in the above cause, testified on his oath as follows: THE WITNESS: I do. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, before we begin with questions, some housekeeping matters. You have a subpoena -- the notice, at least, with duces tecum. MR. SCAROLA: Yes. MR. LINK: So we have 182 pages of documents to be produced. So I'm giving you what we've marked as 1 through 182. We have an additional set of documents that are 183 through 215, that I do not believe are responsive to your notice. They are Bates-numbered emails. I don't know if you want to have these produced and made available to everyone or not. MR. SCAROLA: Are those the documents that have been identified on a privilege log? THE WITNESS: They very well may be. They have Bates numbers on them. I do not Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803636 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 know if they were originally identified on a privilege log, subsequently removed. I don't know the status of them, but they may very well have been originally on a privilege log. MR. SCAROLA: Let me see what you have. We will talk about both of the groups of documents you're producing today and we will decide what, if anything -- MR. IANNO: One group I'm producing. The second group I don't believe is responsive, but I will produce it, if you would like a copy of them. MR. LINK: You have a copy for me of the second group? MR. IANNO: No, because I am not producing them yet. MR. LINK: You delivered them. MR. IANNO: No, no. I didn't deliver them. He's looking at them. I only have one copy. My copy. DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Would you please state your full name? A John Norford Hurley. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803637 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Mr. Hurley, how are you currently employed? A I'm employed by Fowler White Burnett. Q Are you appearing here today on behalf what we will call Fowler White, for abbreviated purposes, in response to a re-notice of taking video deposition of the law firm? A I am. Q I am going to hand you a copy of that notice, and ask you whether you have seen what has now been marked as Exhibit A to this deposition previously. A I have seen the notice of the deposition. (Exhibit A was marked for identification.) BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Can you tell us, please, what role, if any, you played in gathering documents that have been produced in response to this notice of deposition duces tecum? A Together with our counsel, we reviewed documents from our file to determine what was responsive and what wasn't responsive. Q I have been handed a package of documents, which I have not yet had an opportunity to review. Can you tell me, please, the procedure that was used to gather those documents? Where did they come from? A Those are documents which were maintained in Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803638 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the Fowler White file. We have gathered them since 2017 to get all of our file materials together. We have provided our file materials to our counsel. I also reviewed emails from my Outlook box subsequent to delivery of the files to counsel for communications between myself and the Link & Rockenbach firm as it pertain to review of our file materials, and provided those. And they are part of this as well. Q I understand from that response that the documents that we -- have produced today in response to the subpoena -- were assembled into a file. Could you tell us, please, where each of the components of that file originated? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: I can't break it down by document. I can tell you what we did in order to gather the Epstein file materials together. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Thank you. Please do that. A Sure. We did a -- IT did a search of all of our systems, backups for anything pertaining to Mr. Epstein. We looked at the various computers and Outlooks for the attorneys involved in Epstein Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803639 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 communications to gather those emails from those, to the extent that they weren't in our backup. It turns out they all were in backup, anyway, so a duplicate of what we found otherwise. We had the hard materials in our file. Again, this is a 2010 through 2012 basic time period. For the most part, a lot of things were being printed, and so we went through the hard materials we had, as well, and then gathered those -- not into a single file. They are maintained in a single area, which is a protected database that I have access to as general counsel of the firm. Q What were the search terms that were used in reviewing electronically stored information? A I don't know all the search terms we used. We tried to be as comprehensive as we could to gather anything that referred to Mr. Epstein. We used the file numbers. I know that. I don't know of any other terms we used beyond those. Q We have learned through earlier representations that have been made in connection with this matter that a large number of boxes were produced for review to the Link & Rockenbach firm, and that subsequently those boxes were delivered to that firm. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803640 10 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Did your search encompass any of the contents of those boxes? A Yes. Q How? A As far as the documents that were delivered to the Link firm, they were done in two stages. The first stage, the Link firm came to our office -- I believe it was Scott and mostly Tina Campbell -- to review the documents. They flagged certain documents that they wanted to have received. We provided copies of the hard documents that they wanted copied. We provided duplicate of a disc -- discs, plural -- that they wanted duplicated. The hard copies of the documents that were delivered to the Link firm at that time, a copy of those were also put into my protected directory. The discs were not reproduced, so we did not keep anything else from the disc. They were put back in the original file. The second production, when we gave up the entire file of everything we had on this particular matter, excluding our correspondence clips, which were not produced, and which we have retained in our office, we did not keep a copy of those. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803641 11 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q How many discs were contained within the boxes that were produced for review by Link at the time of that initial review? A I have not added them up. Q As you sit here today, do you know how many discs were included within those boxes? A Again, I have not added them up. I just know it was multiple. Q Did you personally see the number of discs? A I'm not sure I understand that. Q Was there a point in time when you looked at the discs in the boxes so that, although you didn't count them, you have some impression as to the number of discs that were there? A I did not view the disc within the boxes that were delivered. Q So as you sit here today, you have no way to even estimate the number of discs that were produced to Mr. Link? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: As I sit here today, I cannot duplicate (sic) the number of discs that were produced to Mr. Link. I believe it can be done. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803642 12 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q How? A When we sent the files to archives, there was an index of the file materials by folder. And the index itself references various discs included: deposition discs, other types of discs that were in there. And that would be the only way. Q Do the documents that you produced today include that index? A No. Q Is that index available? A Yes. Q Is there any reason why that index could not be produced today? That is, do you have any reason to believe that the index itself is in some way not subject to production? MR. IANNO: The answer is yes. To a certain extent, it probably needs to be redacted, depending upon what's on it, because if it's anything like our file index, there's probably privileged information about subjects and things like that. MR. SCAROLA: So the answer today is, I don't know. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803643 13 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: The answer is it could be produced, but probably in a redacted, if not entirely privileged form. THE WITNESS: Further, in review of that -- in review of the duces tecum, we reached the conclusion jointly that it did not fall within any of the areas specifically defined by the duces tecum. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q As you sit here today, do you know how many discs there were included within those 30-plus boxes that contained electronically-stored information that originated with the Rothstein Rosenfeldt Adler or Farmer Jaffe law firms? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: As I sit here today, I don't know if there were any discs in that file that contains those materials. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q As you sit here today, do you know how many discs there were within those files that had been delivered to Fowler White in connection with procedures followed responding to a subpoena that was issued to the Rothstein Rosenfeldt Adler bankruptcy trustee? MR. IANNO: Objection to form. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803644 1 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: We are talking about in December of 2010? BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yes, sir. A It is my understanding, I believe, there were two discs. I believe that's correct. Q What were the contents of those discs? A From my review of the file materials and discussing the matters with the attorneys who were involved in the case, approximately 27,000 or so pages of documents that subsequently were dealt with in three separate ways. It's my understanding certain documents were considered irrelevant, certain documents were eventually deemed to be attorneys' eyes only, and then documents contained within a privilege log. Q Were the documents on the discs divided in that manner? MR. IANNO: Objection to the form. Can you clarify which disc? BY MR. SCAROLA: Q The two discs that you are now referencing. A I don't know how the documents I have never seen those discs. Q What is the basis of your statement that the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803645 15 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 documents on the discs fell into the three categories that you've described? A In my review of various emails at the time, subsequent emails going back and forth, discussions with some of the attorneys involved in the matter. Q You referenced approximately 27,000 documents. Is that the combined total of the pages on both discs that you're referencing? A I believe so, because there's an email from Lilly Ann Sanchez, I believe, to Seth Lehrman in which that figure was contained for a number of boxes that were being sent to Seth Lehrman on December 10. Q Do you know how many of the 27,000 documents were contained on each of the two discs? A I do not. Q Did Fowler White receive both discs simultaneously? A I believe we received materials at one time. Q When? A They were picked up from Judge Carney's house on December 7th of 2010 and Federal Expressed from our Palm Beach office to our Miami office that day; received in the Miami office on December 8th, 2010, I believe. Q How did you make that determine -- those Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803646 16 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 determinations? A The review of emails in the file. Q Were either of the two discs marked or labeled in any way? A I don't know how they were labeled, if at all. Q Do you know whether any discs delivered to Mr. Link were labeled in any way? A I don't know. Q Describe for me, if you would, please, the efforts that you undertook in order to be in a position to speak on behalf of Fowler White during this deposition. MR. IANNO: Objection to form. On what topics? There's none listed in the notice. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Any topics. A Again, I reviewed our file materials of a period of time. I have talked to lawyers involved in the case at the time. I have talked to their assistants involved in the case at the time. I talked to our IT personnel who were here at that time. I talked to a file clerk who was here at that time. Q Who are the lawyers within the Fowler White firm at any time to whom you spoke? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803647 17 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I talked to Lilly Ann Sanchez, Joe Ackerman and Chris Knight. Q Who are the IT personnel to whom you spoke? A David Tobin. Q Spell the last name for us, please. A T-O-B-I-N. Q Who was the law clerk to whom you spoke? A Chris Hewitt. Q Who among those individuals is still a Fowler White employee? A Everybody except for Ms. Sanchez. Q Did you ever speak to Judge Carney with respect to any matters relating to this disc or these discs? A I myself have not. Q Did any agent of Fowler White at any time within the last year speak to Judge Carney? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Our attorneys. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Was any information conveyed by Judge Carney relayed to you? MR. IANNO: That just calls for a yes or no answer, or I don't know. THE WITNESS: Any information, yes. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803648 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What did Judge Carney relate to you regarding the disc? MR. IANNO: Judge Carney didn't relate anything to him, so I am instructing him not to answer. All of his information came from his counsel. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Have you taken into consideration any of the information that you received from Judge Carney in giving any of the responses that you have given thus far? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: No. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Have you personally had any conversation or communication with Herb Stettin regarding the matters that are the subject of the contempt proceedings that are pending? A No. Q Have you had any conversation or communication with Charles Lichtman regarding the subject matter of the pending contempt proceedings? A No. Q Have you had any conversation or Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803649 19 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 communication with Robert Critton regarding the subject matter of the contempt proceedings? A No. Q Have you any conversation or communication with William Scherer regarding the subject matter of the contempt proceedings? A No. Q Has any agent of Fowler White, to your knowledge, had any communication with Herb Stettin, Charles Lichtman, Robert Critton or William Scherer concerning the subject matter of the contempt proceedings? MR. IANNO: Objection to form of the question. THE WITNESS: Not that I'm aware of. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Upon receipt of the discs from Judge Carney on December 7, what happened to them? A They were Federal Expressed on the evening of the 7th to our Miami office, for receipt on the 8th. Q To whom were they directed in the Miami office? A I believe they were sent to Ms. Sanchez, but I'm not positive. Q What is Fowler White's understanding as to Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803650 20 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 why Judge Carney delivered discs to Fowler White on December 7th? A For us to apply Bates stamps to the documents contained on that disc, to make a copy of the contents of the disc for sitting -- returning to Farmer Jaffe. Q And when you talk about a copy, are you talking about a hard copy? A A hard copy of the contents of the disc after being Bates stamped. Q Why were the discs delivered to the Miami office? A We had the facilities in the Miami office to do this job. Q What happened to the discs upon their delivery to the Miami office? A The documents from the discs were used for making a set with Bates stamps applied using our firm's software. Eventually the discs were returned to Judge Carney. Q Were the discs duplicated in whole or in part prior to returning them to Judge Carney? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: No. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803651 21 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When were the discs returned to Judge Carney? A In December of 2010. Q When in December of 2010? A I believe, as best I can tell from the file, approximately December 28th, 2010. Q How many copies of the Bates-stamped contents of the discs were made by Fowler White? A I believe just one for sending to Farmer Jaffe. Q Was that copy sent to Farmer Jaffe? A Yes. Q How was it transmitted? A By Federal Express. Q When? A December 10th, 2010. Q Where were the discs maintained between December 10, when the copying process was completed, and December 28th, when they were delivered to Judge Carney? A I don't know. Q Did Fowler White ever come into possession of any other disc containing electronically-stored information from either Rothstein Rosenfeldt & Adler or Farmer Jaffe? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803652 22 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I don't know for sure. I believe possibly at a later date. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What is the source of that belief? A It is my understanding -- I have been told -- I do not know this from personal knowledge -- that part of the file delivered to Mr. Link's office contained a disc that had materials in it. That disc was contained in a file folder. And in my investigation into that and discussions with people, it's my belief that we received that file folder at a later date than when the original copying took place. Q What date? A I don't know. Q From whom? A Again, I don't know. Q What effort did you make to determine where this disc delivered to Mr. Link came from? A I interviewed the attorneys who were involved. I talked to the file clerk. I talked to the assistants that we still had with us, reviewed our file materials to see if there was any reference in our file materials. And that's pretty much the extent. Q What leads you to believe that the disc that Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803653 23 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 was delivered to Mr. Link from your files originated as a consequence of a disc having been delivered to Fowler White at a later date than December 7, December 8 or December 10? MR. IANNO: Object to form. You can answer if you understand. THE WITNESS: Several aspects. First of all, in my review of the emails at the time of the original copying, Bates stamping, indicate that the discs were being returned to Judge Carney, as contained in an email from Lilly Ann Sanchez to Mr. Lehrman, I believe copied to a number of people. Then we have this file folder. And, again, I am going from what I have been told by third parties, not related to our firm, that the disc was in that file folder. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Who told you that? A Mr. Link's office. Q Who? A I don't recall. Q Continue please. A We took the file folder and we showed it to the people I referenced earlier, if they recognized the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803654 24 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 handwriting on the file folder. Nobody recognized the writing on the file folder. We showed the file folder to our clerk, the file clerk pursued it, asked about the handwriting. He said, I don't recognize the handwriting. Furthermore, I don't recognize the type of file folder. That's not something that we traditionally used. This is all from a photograph of the folder that we received. Q Is that photograph in these materials that you produced? A No. Q Continue. MR. IANNO: It kind of is. This is not a photograph. It's a photocopy. THE WITNESS: To be clear, that is not the photograph that we were shown at the time. MR. IANNO: No. This is an actual copy of the file folder. It's just not a photograph of the folder. THE WITNESS: The photograph of the folder actually showed the folder in more detail than what was produced to you Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803655 25 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 today -- or given to you today, I guess, is a more proper term. So between seeing the emails -- contemporaneous emails about the disc being returned and my interviews with people, I believe that we received that disc at some later time. I can't tell you when and from whom. I have thoughts, but that's all they are. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Share those thoughts with us, please. MR. IANNO: No. They are just speculation. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q That's all right. I want to hear them. A Possibly from Judge Carney, when he was no longer involved. Q And as you say, that's nothing more than speculation on your part. A That's what I said at the beginning. Q Have you been provided with any information as to whether Judge Carney recognized the handwriting on that disc? A I have Q The one delivered to Mr. Link. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803656 26 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I understand. I have not been. MR. IANNO: The disc or the file folder? I just want the record to be clear. MR. SCAROLA: The disc. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q But you can also tell me about the file folder. Has the handwriting on the file folder been identified, to your knowledge? A Not to my knowledge. Q So if I understand your testimony correctly, the only indication to you -- you meaning Fowler White -- that this is not -- this meaning the disc delivered to Mr. Link -- is not a duplicate copy of the disc that was originally received by Fowler White on December 7th, is the type of file folder in which it was stored and the unidentified handwriting on the disc. Is that correct? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: It's actually wrong on a number of different levels. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Okay. Tell me. A I have no idea when that disc was burned that we are talking about here. MR. EDWARDS: When the disc was what? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803657 2 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: Burned. If it was Judge Carney's copy, it would have been a duplicate disc at about that time. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q At about what time? A When the copies were being made, and sent the hard copies to Farmer Jaffe and the Bates stamps being applied. What I'm saying is, I do not believe that that disc was maintained in our file folder from that time in December until sometime later on. It is not just from the handwriting or the type of folder. Again, it's my review of the emails. It's my review of the file and the actions of lawyers over the next two years fighting over the privilege log and things along those lines. Also, it's my review of how our lawyers handled other documents in the file. Q What is it about the way that Fowler White's lawyers handled other documents in the files that supports your speculation about the origin of the disc? MR. LINK: Object to form. THE WITNESS: There was extreme care being taken to ensure that documents were Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803658 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 not seen by inappropriate people. I am referring particularly to the attorneys'- eyes-only documents. There was a request from Roy Black to view these documents. At the time, there were email exchanges as to whether Mr. Indyke would also be entitled to see those. And the idea was, no, he was not going to be entitled to see those, that he would not be shown those, even though he was a lawyer, because everybody wanted to make sure that it was restricted to Mr. Black and not shown outside the scope of attorneys that were involved in the Alan Gray's (phonetics) legal affairs -- scope of the various legal affairs. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Attorneys'-eyes-only documents were shared with Mr. Black? A I don't know if they were eventually sent to him. I don't recall that kind of email. I know that there was an email about him looking at attorneys'- eyes-only documents, and that led to the discussion they would not be shown to Mr. Indyke because of his Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803659 29 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 relationship with Mr. Epstein. And everybody was in agreement with that. Q Who are the lawyers who reviewed attorneys'- eyes-only documents that originated on the disc? A I don't know. Q Who are the Fowler White lawyers who viewed attorneys'-eyes-only documents on the disc? A I do not know. Q What effort did you make to find out who had viewed attorneys'-eyes-only documents on the disc? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: They were not part of my investigation. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did Fowler White determine why it was that care was being taken to restrict access to information that originated on the discs? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. That's just a yes, no, or I don't know answer. I'm not sure we are going to get into what Fowler White actually did, but you can answer that question. THE WITNESS: Can you state it again, please? Or read it back. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803660 30 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yes. Did Fowler White determine why care was being taken to restrict access to information that had originated on those on that disc or those discs? MR. IANNO: Same objection. THE WITNESS: Specifically as to why, no. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did Fowler White become aware of the entry of a court order that restricted access to information contained on the discs.? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: I'm aware of an order entered prior to delivery of the disc in December. I'm aware of discussions apparently regarding a confidentiality order. I don't know if that was ever entered subsequently. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q And what is it that Fowler White knows about an order that was entered prior to delivery of the discs on December 7? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803661 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: The order says that the disc will be delivered to Fowler White, we will apply the Bates stamp, send the copies out, return the disc, and not retain any copies within Fowler White's files. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Does Fowler White agree that the retention of a copy of that disc is in violation of that order? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. Instruct you not to answer. MR. SCAROLA: The basis of the instruction? MR. IANNO: Work-product privilege and outside the scope of this deposition. You're asking him to opine sitting here as an expert witness on an, ultimately, fact, apparently. But we are not here to agree or disagree as to a court order. You're here to get facts. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did Fowler White take steps to avoid retention of any copy of the disc? A Yes. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803662 32 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q What did it do? A The method of Bates stamping required that the disc be utilized by Mr. Tobin in our IT department. Afterwards, any reference of those discs was deleted, I believe, from the program and from his desktop computer, temporary folder. The copies were sent to Farmer Jaffe, as required; and the disc returned to Judge Carney, as required. Q Who was Fowler White representing at the time that it undertook the task of Bates stamping and producing copies of documents contained on the disc? A We were attorneys of record for Mr. Epstein. Q Did Fowler White understand that it was in possession of information that was privileged information of an adversary? MR. IANNO: Object to form, but you can answer if you know the answer. THE WITNESS: We understood that there was a claim that certain documents were privileged. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q During the period of time in question in November of 2009 and December of 2009 -- excuse me of 2010, did Fowler White's attorneys keep time records Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803663 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 with respect to any services that were being rendered on behalf of Jeffrey Epstein? A Yes, they did. Q Are those time records still available? A Yes. Q Are those time records part of what has been produced? A No. Q Why? A They are privileged. Also, I'm not sure they're entirely responsive. Q Have you reviewed them in order to make a determination as to whether there are responsive entries in the time records? A Not for that purpose, no. Q Did any support personnel keep time records with respect to services rendered on behalf of Jeffrey Epstein during the period of time that Fowler White was representing Jeffrey Epstein? A Yes. Q Who are the support personnel that kept time records for Epstein-related services? A There would have been various paralegals who were working on the file. Q Who are those individuals? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803664 34 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I don't recall their names. Q Did you interview any of those individuals? A I did not. I did not see any involvement of them with the disc or handling of the disc in my review of the file materials. Q Did you review their time records to see whether or not the time records reflected any involvement with the discs? A I did. Q Did they? A Not that I saw. Q Did Mr. Tobin keep time records with respect to services that related to the representation of Jeffrey Epstein? A No. Q Does Mr. Tobin keep time records with respect to any of the services that he performed? A No. Q Did the equipment used to generate Bates- stamped copies of documents from the disc record the services performed in making those copies? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I'm not sure I understand the question. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803665 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Photocopy machines sometimes require that an individual identification number be entered by keypad on the machine, and that a case number be entered before the machine will function to generate copies. Was any such equipment that recorded user or use employed with respect to these discs at any time? A That -- again, it's a two-part question. We had the capability at that time to put in file numbers if we were going to bill copies to files. Now it's mandatory. At that time it wasn't mandatory. I have reviewed what was available at the time. Q What did you learn as a consequence of that review? A That there is no indication of copies being made. Q Did you make a determination as to why not? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Just a fact. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Would it not have been part of the firm's policies, practices and procedures to charge 27,000 copies to some specific file? MR. IANNO: Object to form. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803666 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: Our copy procedures are more client-dependent than they are firm. As you know, we have an insurance practice. All of our insurance clients have different policies regarding photocopies. Exceptions are made in particular instances. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Was Mr. Epstein charged for copies? A No. Q During the period of time that Fowler White was representing Mr. Epstein, was Mr. Epstein ever charged for copies? A I believe so. Q When was he charged for copies as opposed to when he wasn't charged for copies? MR. IANNO: Object to form. MR. LINK: Mr. Hurley, one second. I think you can answer that question, but we are not waiving attorney-client privilege between the Fowler White law firm and Mr. Epstein, so I don't want any discussion about strategic decisions, okay? THE WITNESS: I understand. It was a general rule that in the normal day-to-day, Mr. Epstein was charged Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803667 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 for copying. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Why was there an exception to that rule in connection with generating 27,000 plus copies in connection with the task that you have described having been performed in your Miami office sometime between December 8th and December 28th? MR. IANNO: Object to form. You can answer if you know the answer to that question. THE WITNESS: And I do not know. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What effort did you make to find out? A Talked to Ms. Sanchez. She was the attorney who was most involved in this particular part of the process. And she didn't recall. Q Was Mr. Epstein charged for the services involved in the copying project, even if not charged for the copies themselves? A No. Q Was not charging Mr. Epstein for services involved in a copying project of this magnitude in conformity with the standard operating procedures of Fowler White in place at the time? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803668 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 question. I'm going to instruct you not to answer. In compliance with Fowler White's procedures on charging clients are privileged. Whatever they do with regard to their clients is not discoverable, especially not in this proceeding. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did you review invoices generated for services rendered to Mr. Epstein during the period of time between the beginning of November and the end of December of 2010? A I did. Q Were there invoices? A There were invoices covering professional services rendered during that period of time, yes. Q Did any of those invoices reflect any services that related directly or indirectly to the receipt, processing, review or delivery of the discs or any electronically-stored information on the discs or any documents generated from the discs? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. That calls for a yes or no answer, without divulging the contents of those invoices. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803669 3 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: Yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What services were reflected on those invoices that related in any way to the discs? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. I am going to instruct you not to answer based on privilege. MR. SCAROLA: The privilege is? MR. IANNO: Attorney-client. Potentially work product as well. I haven't reviewed the invoices to know exactly what's shown on the invoices for services rendered. MR. SCAROLA: So is it fair to say that you are asserting a privilege without having reviewed the documents to determine whether there is a privilege? MR. IANNO: No. My assertion on privilege is that an attorney's invoices to a client are privileged. I said they may also include work product based on what the invoices say. But for certain, the communications and the invoices are attorney-client privilege. I was specifically referring to work product. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803670 40 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q To whom did invoices for services rendered to Mr. Epstein get sent? A I don't recall. Q Who paid those invoices? A I don't know. Q Calling your attention to Exhibit A of the deposition. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, is it the one that says Exhibit 1? MR. IANNO: It's the depo notice. MR. LINK: Separate from Exhibit 1? MR. IANNO: Yes. It's the notice of deposition. MR. SCAROLA: I don't have -- MR. LINK: You didn't bring copies? MR. SCAROLA: I don't have a third copy of that. I assumed you have a copy of the notice of deposition. I don't have another copy for you. MR. LINK: That's okay. MR. IANNO: I can have copies made, if you want to take a break. It's up to you guys. MR. LINK: I'm okay. Unless Mr. Hurley Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803671 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 needs a break. He has been going about an hour. MR. SCAROLA: Your choice. THE WITNESS: I'm fine right now. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Are the documents that you produced all communications and all records related to the chain of custody of the subject disc? A I don't understand. Is that a question? Q Pardon me? A Was that a question? Q Yes. Did you produce all communications and al_ records relating to the chain of custody of the subject disc? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: I believe so. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did you produce all communications and all records relating to any copies that Fowler White made of the disc? A I believe so. Q Did you produce all communications and all records relating to the chain of custody of alleged Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803672 /12 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 privileged information derived from documents and/or data contained on the subject disc or any copies of the subject disc? A I believe so. Q Did you produce all communications between Fowler White and any third party, including but not limited to Jeffrey Epstein, that referenced or discussed the subject disc and/or alleged privileged information derived from documents and/or data contained on the subject disc or any copies of the subject disc? MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question, because that clearly called for attorney-client privilege information. You can answer. THE WITNESS: Yes, I believe so. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Produced it all? A Yes. Q Did you produce all documents sufficient to identify all persons and/or entities that received copies and/or images of the alleged -- excuse me -- the alleged privilege information derived from the documents and/or data contained on the subject disc or any copies of the subject disc? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803673 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I believe so. Q Did you produce all documents sufficient to identify whether, when and to whom the subject discs, copies of the subject discs, or any data derived from the discs were disseminated? A Yes, I believe so. Q Did you produce all communications and all records relating to efforts made by Fowler White to comply with the requirement of the court's November 2010 order that is the subject of these proceedings from November 1, 2010 to March 1, 2011? A Yes, I believe so. Q Did you produce all communications between Fowler White and Special Master Carney regarding the copying of the documents on the disc, the Bates numbering of the documents on the disc or the methodology that we -- we meaning Fowler White performed to accomplish the copying and Bates-number project? A I believe so. Q Did you produce all communications between Fowler White and any members of the Farmer Jaffe firm regarding the copying or Bates-numbering process? A I believe so. Q So as I understand those responses, nothing Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803674 44 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 falling within the descriptions included within the re-notice of taking video deposition duces tecum has been withheld for any reason; is that correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Within my understanding of the meaning of these requests, the answer is nothing has been withheld. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Thank you. You have in front of you what has been marked as Exhibit B in Composite Exhibit -- MR. IANNO: It hasn't been marked yet. You have the marked copy. (Exhibit B was marked for identification.) MR. LINK: Now we are on Exhibit 1? MR. SCAROLA: We're on Exhibit B. It's a composite exhibit. It includes within in it, numbered exhibits. MR. LINK: Understood. MR. SCAROLA: The first of which is Bl. MR. LINK: Like Bingo. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Going through Exhibit B, the first document is a subpoena duces tecum for deposition documents only issued to Herb Stettin, Trustee in Bankruptcy for Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803675 4 5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Rothstein Rosenfeldt Adler, P.A. Do you recognize this document? A I believe I have seen it before. Q You understand that it was the issuance of the subpoena that ultimately led to the production of the discs that were delivered to Fowler White, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: This or something very similar to this, yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Go to Exhibit 2, if you would please. Looking at Exhibit B2, do you recognize this May 18, 2010 order entered by United States Bankruptcy Court Judge Raymond Ray? A I don't recall having seen this. Q I would like you to look at this document now. And I ask you to note that this purports to be an order from Judge Ray of May 18, 2010, entered in response to a motion by trustee Stettin -- Herb Stettin -- for expedited relief seeking a protective order and approving proposed document production protocol. You see that in the initial sentence of the order? A I do. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803676 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q This document goes on, on the next page, to describe a protocol relating to the production of information in response to the subpoena that we just looked at, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Again, I haven't read the order. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Well, take a look at it. Paragraph two, the end of the order -- excuse me. The end of the first portion of paragraph two says, "The Court approves the following protocol to govern any demand, subpoena or request for production of RRA's electronically stored information." You see that? A Yes. Q Is it Fowler White's assertion that Fowler White was never aware of the entry of this order? MR. IANNO: I will object to form and instruct you not answer. It's outside the scope. Goes to privileged information. MR. SCAROLA: And that privilege is? MR. IANNO: Work product. You're asking for his assertions on an issue that's not involved in this case. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803677 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Go to Exhibit Number 3, if you would please. Do you recognize this document? A I have seen this. Q What do you understand this to be? A That this was the order appointing Judge Carney to act as a special master in regards to discovery issues. Q What did Fowler White understand the originally contemplated procedure to be with respect to responding to the subpoena? MR. IANNO: Object to form. At this point, Mr. Hurley, answer Mr. Scarola's question if you know. THE WITNESS: This is not part of what I was -- have reviewed in my scope as general counsel or preparation for this deposition. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q So your answer is, I don't know? A Correct. Q Turn to Exhibit B4, please. Have you ever seen this document before? A I don't recall having seen this. Q Have you had sufficient opportunity to look Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803678 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 at it to be able to say you have not seen it previously? A Yes. More correctly, I don't recall having seen it previously. Q Go to Exhibit B5, please. Have you ever seen this document before? A I don't recall having seen this. I may have. I don't recall. Q You do agree that Fowler White was representing Jeffrey Epstein on October 15, 2010? A Yes. Q And Fowler White was involved throughout the proceedings that were occurring in bankruptcy court with regard to compliance with the subpoena issued to the bankruptcy trustee, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I do not know the full extent of the involvement. It would be an assumption on my part. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What do you know about Fowler White's involvement in those proceedings? A We were representing Mr. Epstein in regards to trying to obtain documents as part of the lawsuit. Q And the effort to obtain documents was the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803679 49 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 issuance of a subpoena to the bankruptcy trustee appointed to control all of the assets, including all documents that were generated in the conduct of business by the Rothstein Rosenfeldt & Adler firm, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: It involved the issuance of the subpoena to the trustee in the bankruptcy. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q And Fowler White you know from your review of electronic communications -- was directly involved in negotiating the procedures that were to be followed in an effort to obtain that production and to identify privileged materials in connection with that production, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: In my review, I focused on the procedures leading up to providing the disc to Fowler White. I did not concentrate on what happened prior to that. So as far as what happened between the issuance of the subpoena and to the discussions as to how Fowler White -- or how Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803680 5 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 these discs were to be handled -- the information was to be handled in regards to the development of a privilege log, I didn't review that. The time we were concerned with, we are going to have a privilege log. How do we get the documents handled forward was what I concentrated my review on. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q You understood that Fowler White was responsible for assuring that no privileged information, no potentially privileged information could be accessed as a consequence of Farmer White's excuse me -- Fowler White's involvement in the production procedure, correct? A No. THE WITNESS: Sorry. MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. I was going to instruct you not to answer, but okay. MR. SCAROLA: I'm not sure -- have you -- MR. IANNO: But he answered it. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q I haven't heard the answer. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803681 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A The answer was no. Q So it is Fowler White's position in this deposition that Fowler White was unaware, as of the time that it came into possession of the discs delivered in response to the subpoena that had been issued at Fowler White's request, that Fowler White had an obligation to protect against any access to privileged or potentially privileged information on that disc; is that correct? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. Go ahead and answer that question. THE WITNESS: First of all, that's different than the prior question. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q That's the one I am asking right now. A And my response is, we had obligations under an order as to what we were to do, and I believe we complied with that order. Q Did you understand that what you were to do included implementing procedures that would guard against access by any adverse party to privileged information or potentially privileged information contained on the discs that were to be delivered to Fowler White? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803682 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question. THE WITNESS: I think what you're stating is beyond what the obligations under the order were. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Could you answer my question, please? MR. IANNO: He did. THE WITNESS: I did. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Is the answer then, no, you didn't believe you had that obligation? A No. My answer is, we had obligations under a court order. I believe what you had stated is beyond what the court order says. Q In what respect? A In that I believe we had obligations while we were in possession of the disc to handle the disc properly; to return the documents and the disc; to make sure there were no copies made while it was in our possession or disseminated to anyone while it was in possession at that time. Q Did you understand that Fowler White was prohibited from retaining any information that was contained on those discs? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803683 53 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: At that time, yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Is it your understanding that that prohibition ended at some point in time? A There were times, I believe, in the future when, in fact, copies of some of that disc were produced to us. Q Let's identify each of those. When did Fowler White come into possession, subsequent to December of 2010, of any information that originated on the discs? MR. LINK: Object to form of the question. You can answer if you know. THE WITNESS: I don't know the dates. Further, we have never reviewed the contents of the disc, so we are assuming that they were of the disc. We were informed that -- I believe I have seen in emails as to the irrelevant emails and attorneys'-eyes-only documents. I believe those were part of the original disc delivered. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q So there came a point in time, subsequent to Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803684 54 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Fowler White receiving the discs, that Fowler White received documents which it was informed had originated on the discs that were irrelevant; is that correct? A That's my understanding. Q There came a point in time when Fowler White received documents which it understood to have originated on the discs that were being produced for attorneys' eyes only; is that correct? A That is my understanding. Q What is Fowler White's understanding of the specific restrictions that applied to the attorneys'- eyes-only production? MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question. I instruct you not to answer. It's outside the scope of this deposition pursuant to Judge Ray's order. THE WITNESS: Jack, let me know when is a good time that I can go to the restroom. MR. SCAROLA: You got it. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 11:16 a.m. (A recess was had.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the record. The time is 11:36 a.m. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803685 5 5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Please turn to Exhibit 6 -- B6. Have you ever seen this document before? A I don't recall having seen this before. Q Turn to Exhibit 7, please. Have you seen B7 previously? A I don't recall for sure if I have. Q Do you recall that an issue arose with regard to the cost involved in Bates stamping and printing information from the discs that were ultimately delivered to Fowler White? A Yes. Q Do you recall that Fowler White volunteered to undertake the task of printing and Bates stamping? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do you recall that that was as a consequence of Jeffrey Epstein's refusal to bear the cost of printing and Bates stamping the documents? MR. IANNO: Object to form. I don't know if you want to instruct -- Well, on behalf of Epstein -- if your knowledge only came because as a result of Counsel -- because Fowler White was counsel Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803686 76 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 for Epstein and it was based on attorney-client communication, don't answer that. THE WITNESS: And I don't have knowledge one way or another on that. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Turn to Composite Exhibit B8. Have you seen the email of October 25, Charles Lichtman? A I don't recall having seen this one. Q Did you have knowledge of the delivery of a CD that, for whatever reason, could not be opened and read by the Farmer Jaffe firm? A I recall seeing an issue with -- a problem with the first CD that was delivered. I don't recall what the issue was. Q Do you recall having seen the email exchange on the next page from Charles Lichtman to Gary Farmer, of November 4, 2010? A I don't recall having seen this. No. Q The next email in this composite is an email of November 9, 2010, first from Robert Carney to Luis Torres, with a copy to Lilly Ann Sanchez. Have you seen that email before? A Yes, I have. 2010, from Seth Lehrman to Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803687 57 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Did you see the response from Luis Torres to Judge Carney on November 9, 2010? A I believe so. Q Do you know whether the deliveries that are discussed in that email exchange took place? A I don't know. Q The next page includes an exchange of email communications between Judge Carney and various individuals, including Lilly Ann Sanchez on November 9, 2010. Did you see that exchange of communications? A I don't recall specifically if I saw these. I believe so. But I don't recall for sure. Q Do you know whether the exchange of CDs discussed in that email communication took place? A I do not know. Q Have you seen the letter of November 9, 2010, that is the next document in this composite exhibit? A I do not recall having seen this before. Q Do you recall ever having seen documents marked in the way in which the disc that is photocopied on the attachment to this letter is marked? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. Can you repeat that? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803688 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do you recall ever having seen CDs marked in the way that the CDs that are photocopied as an attachment to this letter -- A No. Q -- are marked? A No. Q Have you seen exchanges of communications that are included on the next page that took place on Wednesday, November 10, 2010? A I believe so. Q Copies of these documents were within the records that you reviewed in preparation for this deposition. A I don't recall for sure. Q If they were, they would be included in the large stack of documents that you produced here. MR. LINK: Object to form. THE WITNESS: If I reviewed them in preparation for this deposition, I believe they would be there. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Go to the next page, if you would please. Do you recall having seen the exchange of communications reflected on this page from Thursday, November 11, Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803689 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 2010? A Yes. Q Does Judge Carney's account of the communication that he had with Lilly Ann Sanchez conform with what Fowler White believes to have happened as of November 10, 2010? MR. LINK: Object to form. I instruct you not to answer. MR. SCAROLA: Basis of that instruction? MR. LINK: Work product, mental impressions, attorney-client privilege, outside the scope. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Have you previously seen the exchange of communications on the next page purporting to have occurred November 12, 2010? A To make sure we're on the same one, that's the email from Mr. Lichtman to Judge Carney and Mr. Farmer. Q There are two emails: one from Mr. Lichtman to Judge Carney, and one from Judge Carney to Gary Farmer. A Yes, I have seen this. Q Going to the next page. Have you seen that Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803690 60 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 exchange of communications? A Yes, I have. Q Email exchanges on November 12, 2010. A Yes, I have. Q Both the November 11 -- excuse me. Both the November 12 exchange at 7:30 a.m. and 7:57 a.m., and the exchange that took place at 8:40 a.m. and 9:24 a.m. are part of the business records of Fowler White? MR. LINK: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I believe so. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Going to the next email that is dated and timed November 12, 2010 at 9:01 a.m., is that a document that you have seen before? A I'm not positive. Q Are you aware of strong reservations having been expressed by Gary Farmer to turning over the discs containing potentially privileged materials to Jeffrey Epstein's legal counsel. MR. IANNO: You're asking if he was aware then or based on reading this? BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Are you aware, as you sit here today, that strong reservations were expressed by Gary Farmer on behalf of his law firm and Brad Edwards to a procedure Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803691 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 that involved turning over potentially privileged material to Jeffrey Epstein and his legal counsel? A I'm aware that he was questioning the proposed process, yes. Q And objected to it? A I'm not sure I read these that he objected to it. He was questioning the process and eventually agreed to it. Q He questioned the process because he was concerned about the security of potentially privileged information, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I presume that's what he was thinking, because that's what seems to be written down here. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Have you previously seen Judge Carney's response to Mr. Farmer A I have. Q -- dated November 12, 2010 at 8:40a.m.? A I have. Q And as part of the business records of Fowler White that you reviewed? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Yes. I believe so. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803692 62 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Have you previously seen the November 15, 2010, 9:16 a.m. communication from Lilly Sanchez to Charles Lichtman and Robert Carney? A I have. Q Was that also part of the business records of Fowler White that you reviewed? A Yes. I believe so. Q Did you see the exchange of communications between Judge Carney and Lilly Sanchez that are included on the next page of this composite exhibit MR. IANNO: Object to form. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q including the November 12, 2010, 9:25 a.m. communication and the November 12, 2010, 8:40 a.m. communication? MR. IANNO: Same objection. THE WITNESS: Okay, that starts on the beginning of the prior page. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yes, sir. That's where the date of the top email is. A I have seen these before. Q Also part of the business records of Fowler White that you reviewed in preparation for this Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803693 63 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 deposition? A I believe so. Q Going to the next page. Did you review the November 16, 2010, 3:21 p.m. email from Judge Carney to various individuals including Lilly Sanchez? A I have seen this before. Q Also part of the business records of Fowler White that you reviewed in connection with this deposition? A I believe so. Q Did you -- have you seen the email exchange on the next page of this composite exhibit, including the November 23, 2010, 3:34 p.m. email; the November 23, 2010, 5:14 p.m. email; and the November 29, 2010, 4:26 p.m. email? A I don't recall specifically if I have or not. Q With regard specifically to those emails that reflect that they were directed either to Lilly Sanchez directly or by copy, do you have any reason to doubt the authenticity of those documents? A No. Q Have you previously seen Joseph Ackerman's email to Brad Edwards of November 29, 2010, at 3:30 p.m.? A I have. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803694 6 4 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Was that part of the business records of Fowler White that you reviewed in preparation for this deposition? A I believe so. Q Have you seen the proposed agreed order that is the next document in this composite exhibit? A I'm not positive if I have seen this. Q Have you seen preliminary drafts of the order that is now the subject of the pending contempt proceeding? A I don't recall specifically. Q The next page of this composite exhibit includes an exchange of communications on December 7, 2010, at 10:48 and 11:09 a.m. Have you seen those communications previously? A I have. Q Also the December 7, 10:20 a.m. email from Seth Lehrman to Joseph Ackerman? A I don't recall specifically if I saw that or not. Q The other two you do specifically recall are part of the business records that -- of Fowler White that you reviewed in connection with your preparation for this deposition? A Yes. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803695 65 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Have you previously seen the order of November 30, 2010, that is the next -- A Exhibit 9. Q Exhibit 9 -- B9 in this composite exhibit. A I have. Q What, if anything, do you know about the distribution of this order within Fowler White after its entry? A I know that the attorneys involved in the case were aware of the order. I don't know how or when it was distributed to them. Q Who are the lawyers that you know -- who are the Fowler White lawyers, that you know, were aware of the contents of this order? A Joe Ackerman, Lilly Ann Sanchez and Chris Knight. Q How do you know Joe Ackerman was aware? MR. IANNO: Don't disclose the contents because -- and just tell him what capacity you know that as. THE WITNESS: From my discussions with Joe. And I believe he might have been on the court distribution list. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When did Joe Ackerman become aware of the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803696 66 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 contents of this order? A I don't know. Q When did Lilly Ann Sanchez become aware of the contents of this order? A I don't know the specific date. Q When did Chris Knight become aware of the contents of this order? A I don't know the specific date. Q Do you know if anyone else within Fowler White was informed of the contents of this order at any time between the entry of the order on November 30th, 2010, and January 1st, 2017? A I don't know for sure. Q Was a copy of this order among the papers included in the files that were made available to Scott Link? A I don't know. Q In the ordinary course of the business of Fowler White, would this order have been included among the documents that were made available to Mr. Link? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: It would have been on a pleading clip likely, but I don't know for sure if it was. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803697 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q So the response to my question as to whether, in the ordinary course of the business of Fowler White, this order would have been included in Fowler White's file materials made available to Mr. Link, the answer to that question is yes, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Ordinarily as an order would be on the pleading clip. I don't know if it was. I don't know if I can give you a better answer than that. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When you say that ordinarily it would be on the pleading clip, what does that mean? A It means ordinarily at that time -- especially when we kept paper files -- the pleadings would be on a pleading clip. Q And describe for the benefit of the court, please, what a pleading clip is as that term is used or was used in Fowler White during this period of time? A It is folder where pleadings are kept together. Q Are they kept together and indexed? A Sometimes. Q In the ordinary course of the business of Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803698 CC) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Fowler White, are documents in the pleading clip indexed in the pleading clip? A There was no firm policy at that time. Q Regardless of whether there was a firm policy, was the general procedure of Fowler White to index documents in its pleading clips? MR. IANNO: Object to form. I'm going to instruct you not to answer. It's outside the scope of the deposition. You know, I will let you ask him about this specific case, but we are not going to get into the general procedures of Fowler White on how they file things. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Other than making Mr. Knight, Mr. Ackerman and Ms. Sanchez aware of the provisions of this order, did Fowler White do anything else at all in order to assure that the provisions of the order of November 30, 2010, were complied with? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: It is my understanding, yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803699 69 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A We made sure that in the Bates-stamping process the files that would have been derived as part of the process were deleted immediately. The copying process did not result in images being made for preservation in our system. The documents were sent immediately upon conclusion to Farmer Jaffe. The discs were returned to Judge Carney. Q Did anyone inform David Tobin of the prohibitions included within the November 30, 2010 order? A I believe so. Q Who? A Lilly Ann Sanchez. Q What is the basis of that belief? A My discussions with Lilly Ann. Q She told you, I told David Tobin about the provisions of this court order? MR. IANNO: That's attorney-client privilege. Remember, Mr. Hurley is general counsel for the firm. He can tell you as corporate rep what his knowledge is based on, but the substance of those communications are going to be privileged. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803700 70 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did David Tobin tell you that he knew about the restrictions included within this order? MR. IANNO: Same objection. Instruct you not to answer. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did anyone inform support personnel within Fowler White of the provisions of the November 30, 2010 order, other than Mr. Tobin? A Again, I believe so. Q Who? A I don't know who specifically would have told them. But my information -- sorry. Q Which support personnel were informed? A I do not know. Q What were they told? MR. IANNO: Object to form. Instruct you not to answer. MR. SCAROLA: Let's take a couple minutes, please. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 12:04 p.m. (A recess was had.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the record. The time is 12:12 p.m. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803701 71 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. SCAROLA: I have no further questions at this time, subject to overruling of all the unfounded objections you have raised. MR. IANNO: Or sustaining them. MR. SCAROLA: Or sustaining them, as the case may be. MR. IANNO: There you have it. Good enough. MR. LINK: I sustain them right now. CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Mr. Hurley, are you aware that Link & Rockenbach have represented that that firm received a disc with the handwriting "Epstein Bate Stamp" and the disc contained over 27,000 Bates-stamped documents received from Fowler White? MR. IANNO: Pages. Not documents. Pages. MR. EDWARDS: Pages. THE WITNESS: A lot of parts to that question. The answer is, I am aware that they have said that they received a disc with the number of documents on there. I don't recall if we talked about the rest of Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803702 72 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the parts of your question, as far as how the disc was titled or framed or written on. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q My understanding from your testimony today is you have not personally reviewed the disc. A I have never seen the disc. Q And so personal knowledge, you're not sure what's on the disc or what's not on the disc? A That is correct. Q But based on the representation that has been made, that this is a disc that was within a box that was delivered to Link & Rockenbach from Fowler White, do you have any reason to believe that that statement is not accurate? A I don't have a reason to believe that Mr. Link is not being truthful. Q So as you sit here, you believe the disc that we're talking about is a disc that was actually in a Fowler White box, and a copy was delivered, along with boxes of Epstein material, to Link & Rockenbach? A That's the assumption I have. Q And based on all the information that you have to this point, you have no reason to dispute that assumption? A That is correct. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803703 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Just based on what I have heard today, it's your understanding, after having reviewed all of the materials that were available to you and speaking with the people who you thought were important people to speak with in your investigation of determining where the disc came from and whether or not it originated from Fowler White, do you believe that you have talked with everybody who could provide you any of that information? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Yes. MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. MR. LINK: I sustain that objection, by the way. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q It was a poor question, but you know what I'm saying. Have you talked -- are there any witnesses -- after we have had discussions today, are there any other people that you think have information that could help us with the chain of custody of that particular CD? MR. IANNO: Object to form. Answer if you know. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803704 74 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: Not that I can think of. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Are there any additional documents, business records of Fowler White -- documents that you have not yet reviewed but would like to review to help solidify any conclusions that you have reached? A No. Q So it's my understanding from your testimony tell me if anything about this is inaccurate -- that two CDs were FedExed from Special Master Carney to Lilly Ann Sanchez. Is that correct? A That's incorrect. Q Okay. A Two CDs were picked up from Judge Carney on the December 7 by our Palm Beach office and FedExed by our Palm Beach office to the Miami office. Q Those two CDs that were picked up on December 7th and delivered to the Miami Fowler White office on December 8th, do you know if those CDs had any type of markings on them at all? A I have never -- I did not see the CDs, and before being shown exhibits today, have never seen any photocopies of the CDs or had them described to me. Q Are you aware of any photocopies of the CDs having been made by Fowler White? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803705 75 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A As far as the photocopy of the physical CD? Q Right. So that you would know what the cover looked like. A Not that I recall after seeing them. Q Were there any materials such as time records that were or are available to you that would help make a determination what the CDs -- the cover of the CDs looked like when they arrived December 8th, 2010, to Fowler White? A No. Q The people that you spoke with -- Lilly Ann Sanchez, Joe Ackerman, Chris Knight and your IT -- David Tobin -- A Correct. Q -- did you discuss with them what the CDs looked like when they arrive to Fowler White on December 8, 2010? MR. IANNO: You can answer whether you discussed it, but not the substance. THE WITNESS: No. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Do you know what -- do you know which computer within Fowler White was used to insert the CDs that were received on December 8th that ultimately led to the printing process? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803706 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A Yes. Q And have you reviewed the hard drive of that computer to see if there were any images or copies of the CD or the documents thereon left on that computer? A I have not personally reviewed it. That computer is no longer in use at Fowler White. Q Do you know where that computer is? A It was discarded when we changed our computer hardware. Q Is there a central hard drive to the firm where copies of things that are saved on a particular computer system are also saved to a backup? A It depends on how they are saved. If they're saved to the actual hard drive, the CPU or personal directory, the answer is no. Q The process that you understand took place on December 8th is the CD is placed into a computer, the computer system is used to Bates stamp or Bates number all of the documents on that CD and then it's printed? MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question. THE WITNESS: Generally correct, a little bit more than that. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Okay. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803707 77 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A They are put onto -- in this particular case, would have been using Mr. Tobin's desktop computer. You apply the program, which I believe is XL Acrobat Pro or one of the Acrobat programs to do the Bates stamp, using a temporary folder on his desktop. That is then burned onto a CD with the Bates stamps. What I don't know is if the print order is sent from the desktop or is used from the CD that was burned. Q So I just want to understand the burning process. So it comes in as two CDs. A Correct. Q Presumably one CD has some of these 27,500 documents and some of the other CD has the remainder of these 27,500 documents, right? A I have no idea. We received two CDs, I believe, then they were put onto a CD. Q To your knowledge, between the two CDs was over 27,000 documents? A My understanding. Q Only one CD can go in at a time; is that right? A Correct. Q So the CD is going to be inserted into the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803708 78 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 computer. And is it your understanding, then, that CD is first uploaded to the temporary folder in Mr. Tobin's computer? A Yes. Q That CD is then ejected. Second CD is put in. And that second CD, the contents thereof, are uploaded to the temporary folder on Mr. Tobin's computer. A That is correct. Q Then a new CD -- a clean CD -- is put in, and the contents from the temporary folder that are comprised of whatever was uploaded from CD one and whatever was uploaded from CD two are combined and put onto this fresh CD. MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: Once the Bates stamps are applied, that is put onto the new CD. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q So the new CD would be CD one plus CD two, plus Bates numbers. That would be the contents of the new CD. MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: That would be my presumption. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803709 79 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. EDWARDS: Q The original two CDs that arrived, those are CDs that Fowler White then sends back to Judge Carney, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I believe they were returned to Judge Carney. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Do you know how they were returned to Judge Carney? A There's a Federal Express label to Judge Carney, I believe, by Federal Express. Q Do you know what date that the two CDs were Federal Expressed to Judge Carney? A I saw a Federal Express label from December 28th. Q The single CD that has now the 27,000 plus documents Bates numbered, was that CD also sent to Judge Carney? A I believe so. Q What information are you relying on to -- for your belief that a total of three CDs relating to this copy job were sent back to Judge Carney? A We have an email indicating that CDs are being sent to Judge Carney. I have, I believe, seen Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803710 80 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 emails which indicate to me that Judge Carney had a disc with Bates-stamped documents on them that were being utilized for months afterwards, to a certain extent. Nobody ever raised an objection that they didn't have the CDs. Q Because the original two CDs that came in, they had no Bates stamp on them. A Correct. Q So even after this process where the contents from those two CDs are uploaded to this temporary folder, that's not going to change the composition of those first two CDs. A They were not changeable. Q So the new CD would be the only CD that would have the Bates-stamped numbers on them? A That's my understanding. Q Was there any additional copy at that time in 2010 of the single CD that had the Bates-stamped copies on them? A I'm not aware of other CDs being made with Bates-stamp numbers. Q So to the best of your knowledge, at that point in time, December of 2010, Fowler White has taken in two CDs, upload them to a temporary file, placed on a new CD the contents of both of those -- the contents Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803711 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 of both of those CDs, this time with Bates numbers on it, and all three CDs were sent to Judge Carney. A That's my understanding. Q There was one copy of hard copy documents derived from the new CD that would be hard copies of all of the contents of the new CD, which would include the Bates-stamped numbers on it. A That's my understanding. Q Those documents, then, if I understand your testimony, were FedExed out December 10th to be delivered to Farmer Jaffe December 13th. A I don't know the delivery date. They were FedExed December 10th. Q And what was sent to Farmer Jaffe was the hard copy documents only. A That is what appears to be reflected in the email I reviewed. Q And from those 27,000-plus documents, it's your understanding that, eventually, one batch of documents was produced to Fowler White labeled something along the lines of irrelevant? MR. IANNO: Object to form. You can answer if you know. THE WITNESS: I'm not sure. I'm not sure. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803712 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. EDWARDS: Q I thought I understood -- A I believe so. I'm not positive. Q Your understanding is there was a second batch that was delivered and it was labeled or titled attorneys' eyes only. MR. IANNO: Same objection. THE WITNESS: Again, I believe that we received documents that were labeled attorneys' eyes only. The how and when they were delivered to Fowler White, I do not know, or if they were even delivered separately from the irrelevant documents. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Okay. I wasn't try to imply by my question that they were delivered separately. Just that -- of the documents that were delivered, there was a batch -- could have been delivered on the same day -- but there was a batch that was labeled irrelevant. There was another batch labeled attorneys' eyes only. A There was a batch which I understood was irrelevant. There was a batch I understand were attorneys' eyes only. Q And the attorneys'-eyes-only batch is a batch that Roy Black contacted Fowler White, as he wanted to Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803713 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 view that particular set of documents. MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question. THE WITNESS: I believe there was a request from Roy Black to have seen the attorneys'-eyes-only documents. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Did you produce was there correspondence, emails or otherwise from Roy Black or Roy Black's office to that effect? A I don't recall if there was an email from Mr. Black's office. Q Have you produced emails or correspondence from Mr. Black about the viewing of the attorneys'- eyes-only documents? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I don't believe so. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q In preparation for your deposition, do you remember viewing these -- any correspondence that would have allowed for your testimony today about the fact that Roy Black contacted Fowler White to view those documents? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803714 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: My preparation review for today's depo was restricted to the issues which I considered was the scope of my deposition, which was the handling of the disc and the privileged documents on the disc. In my review of the file, I recall seeing that exchange pertaining to the attorneys' eyes only. The only reason it was relevant to me and why I recall it is because of the care that was being expressed about making sure a restriction that -- whatever exposure there was to those documents was a very limited exposure and would never work their way back to Mr. Epstein. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q It was relevant to you because the care the attorneys at Fowler White took to protect the attorneys'-eyes-only documents, you would expect to be the same type or greater care to the universe of documents that was delivered and placed on a CD and printed and sent to Farmer Jaffe. MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I believe we would be Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803715 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 equally cautious as to all of those types of documents. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Retaining a CD with all of the documents that came in that day, Bates-numbering -- Bates-numbered documents that came in that day would be inconsistent with the type of care that you saw in your review of how the attorneys'-eyes-only documents were treated by the attorneys that were handling the case? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: An intentional keeping of a disc or make of an extra disc at that time -- first of all, I have seen nothing in the file at all -- any indication of that. And it would not be what we would have done or should have done. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q And you would agree there's no way to accidentally make another copy of the disc, right? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: You know, I would not think so. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q At some point in time in early 2018 -- I think it's January -- Mr. Link and, I think, Tina from Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803716 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 his office came to Fowler White to review boxes of Epstein's material. A That is correct. Q While there, flagged certain documents or items that they wanted copies of. A That is correct. Q Were you watching over that review and flagging process? A I was not. Q Was anybody from Fowler White watching over that review and flagging process? A We were not in the room with them. Q Prior to anyone from Mr. Link's office arriving, did someone from Fowler White inventory the boxes that were being reviewed by Mr. Link? A We had an inventory from the closed file process. Q When did the closed file process occur? A 2014 or early 2015. Q How detailed is the inventory from the 2014 closed file process? A It contains box numbers. It contains labels of folders within the box. Q Within that inventory, was there an indication of a CD labeled "Epstein Bate Stamp"? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803717 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A The inventory did not state that, no. Q Is there anything from your review of the inventory that would indicate that there was a CD containing Epstein Bates stamped documents? A Nothing mentioning any CD with Epstein Bates stamped documents. Q Was there anything mentioning the retention of any Epstein Bates stamped documents? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I don't recall if there was any reference to Bates-stamped documents whatsoever in there. I don't recall. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q From your review of the inventory -- is it inventory list? A It's inventory. Q From your review of the inventory, is there an indication that, at that point in time when the file was closed in 2014, Fowler White had in its possession the CD that is -- that's now contained -- the handwriting that says "Epstein Bate Stamp"? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: There is nothing in the inventory that mentions that CD. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803718 oc 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. EDWARDS: Q There was -- was there any reference to any disc on that inventory? A Yes. Q How many discs were referenced? A I covered this with Mr. Scarola. I never counted it up. Q Were there specific notations about the various discs that were referenced in the inventory to give you some idea of what might be on those discs? A Sometimes. Q What were some of those things that would have been on the disc? A Depositions -- MR. IANNO: Don't give anything that would give away work product or anything like that. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Was there any description of any of the discs that was in this inventory that would now lead you to believe that what was on those discs were these "Epstein Bate Stamp" documents? A No. Q Is there anything on that inventory that tells you, as you sit here, that in 2014, Fowler White Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803719 89 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 had in its possession the CD? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Nothing that specifically mentions the CD. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Is there anything that mentions anything that would tell you that Fowler White had in its possession that CD or the documents that were on that CD. MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Nothing that mentions the CD or the documents. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q I thought I understood from your previous testimony that you believe, on behalf of Fowler White, that the CD in question was received sometime later after 2010 -- A Correct. Q -- by Fowler White. A Correct. Q What is it that makes you believe that that CD was received back by Fowler White sometime later? MR. IANNO: Objection. Asked and answered. THE WITNESS: Yeah. A number of different factors taken together. First, Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803720 90 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the file folder that I have been advised the CD was located in, the writing on the folder was not recognized by anybody in our group. The language used doesn't seem to be the same as what I have been told now is on the disc. The folder itself was not the type of folder we used. Looking at the file itself, there is what appears to be a chain of custody showing return of the disc to Judge Carney. There then is a complete absence of any mention of the disc or the privilege documents themselves as opposed to the privilege log dispute from that point forward, until we get to the first week of March 2018. So there's nothing to indicate that we would have retained a disc or looked at a disc. And the file in which the disc itself was in was not the type of file that we would have expected to have seen. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Is there anything on the inventory that leads you to believe that the CD that we are talking about that says "Epstein Bate Stamp" was not in the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803721 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 possession of Fowler White in 2014? A You can't tell from the inventory itself, no. Q We talked about the file folder. One of the things that you mentioned is the type of folder is not the type of folder that Fowler White typically had. That's one of the things that tells you this is something that arrived at Fowler White after 2010. A That was a piece of all the information I received, yes. Q The handwriting on the file folder was not handwriting that was recognized -- recognizable by any of the attorneys that were working on the case back then. A That is correct. Q Is the handwriting that was on the file folder consistent with the handwriting that was on the disc that says "Epstein Bate Stamp"? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I never saw the disc before today, so I don't know. MR. LINK: Did you see the disc today? THE WITNESS: I saw pictures of a disc here if that's what we're talking about. Are you talking about the disc supposedly that was contained in the file? I have Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803722 2 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 never seen that disc at all. MR. LINK: Just for the record, that disc has been sealed. It's not been made available. MR. EDWARDS: I thought that there was a photocopy of that disc. MR. IANNO: No. MR. EDWARDS: Cover of that disc -- there hasn't been. MR. IANNO: He hasn't seen it then and he hasn't seen it today. MR. LINK: It's sealed. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q How did you get the copy of file folder and the, I guess, alleged contents of the file folder in which this disc was kept? MR. IANNO: Object to form. He never said he got the contents of the file folder. THE WITNESS: I received -- MR. IANNO: You can tell him how you got it, but that's as far as you can go. THE WITNESS: I don't recall if it was directly from Mr. Link or whether it was Mr. Link to our attorneys to me. I received a picture or a photocopy of the folder Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803723 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 cover. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q I misunderstood your prior testimony. I apologize. Is it your understanding that there was just a file folder and the only thing that was inside that file folder was the CD? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: It's my understanding that there was a file folder. I have been told that within that file folder there was a CD. I have not been told about anything else within that file folder. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Is it your understanding that the only person that was sent a CD with these documents Bates numbered on them was Special Master Carney? A I have not seen any document indicating anybody else got a Bates stamped CD. Q Which is what leads you to believe that if this was a CD received from some outside source after 2010 to Fowler White, then it likely came from Special Master Carney. MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Part of, again, the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803724 94 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 overall bit of information, but it's one of the factors, yes. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q What are the other factors? A What I talked about. It has his name on it. We don't know who else it went to or would have seen it. There's nothing in our file to indicate that there was any other copy made for anybody else. There is no mention of either the disc or the contents of the disc in eight years. So it's -- that all leads together it came back from somebody, I believe. And the only person I could conclude, which is my speculation, was Judge Carney. Q Because he's the only person that you knew to have had a copy of that disc? A I have no idea what happened to the content of the disc once it left our possession. Q Do you know whether it arrived back to Fowler White in 2011 or whether it arrived back in 2017? A I do not know. I do not know. Q You only know that it arrived back to Fowler White sometime after it left Fowler White, which is December of 2010, and it was and the latest it could have arrived back is sometime before January 2018. MR. IANNO: Object to form. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803725 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: Assuming all of the information I have is truthful information, the answer is yes. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Is there anything else that helps you pare down when that disc might have been received back by Fowler White? A If the information I received is true, I do know that the folder was in the Fowler White file as of 2011. Q How do you know that? A It's on the disc. Q That's on the inventory? A Yes. There's nothing that describes the contents of the folder on the inventory, just the title of the folder. Q So by the title, you know that it's -- by the title you believe that it's the same folder? A The title is similar to the photocopy of the cover that I was provided. Q Who created that inventory? A Chris Hewitt. Q And he's the one who would have created that entry into the inventory? A Yes. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803726 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q Did you speak with Chris Hewitt about when the file folder might have come into the possession of Fowler White? A I asked him that. Q And? MR. IANNO: You can tell him the results of your investigation. I just don't want there to be a waiver of privilege. You can tell him information that's known to the corporation for the purpose of this deposition, but not privileged communication. THE WITNESS: He has no recollection of that. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Do you know whether the file folder was delivered to Fowler White by mail, hand delivery or what form? A Do not know. Q Is there a process of inventorying information as its received by Fowler White such as this? A No. Q Do you know who would have handled the file Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803727 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 on behalf of Fowler White whenever it was received? A No. Q Do you know if it was received while Fowler White was still active counsel for Jeffrey Epstein? A I believe not, but I do not know for sure. Q What makes you believe that Fowler White was no longer active counsel for Jeffrey Epstein when Fowler White received the file? A There's no reference to a file or a disc in any document that I reviewed. Q After Fowler White discontinued representing Jeffrey Epstein, that was sometime in 2012, right? A We withdrew in May of 2012, I believe. Q What happened to the file folder that the bad question. What happened to the boxes of Epstein material at that time? A The file was maintained in our office until 2014, beginning of 2015, when it was sent to our off-site storage facility, which I believe was Iron Mountain. Q And at that point in time, the file that we were talking that allegedly contained this CD in 2015 was in Fowler White's possession? A The folder was shown on the inventory, yes. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803728 98 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Q And was the first time that a full inventory was performed in 2014? A It would have been when we began the closing process. It's my understanding that was in late 2014. Q Do you know if this particular entry into the inventory was done in late 2014 or 2015? A We cannot determine that. Q You tried to determine that? A Yes. Q Was there any communication that you found from Special Master Carney or anyone else about the delivery of the file folder to Fowler White? A No. Q Did Lilly Ann Sanchez -- strike that. Did your investigation reveal that anyone at Fowler White reviewed the file folder when it came into Fowler White? A No. Q In 2018 when Mr. Link goes down to Fowler White and flags certain items, including this CD, what was the process for copying that CD for Mr. Link? A A copy of the CD was just burned from that CD. Q After that particular CD was flagged, was there an attorney for Fowler White that reviewed the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803729 99 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 documents that were flagged before copies were made? A No. Q Was it the same IT person, David Tobin, who performed this copying? A I don't know. Q Is David Tobin still here? A Yes. Q What was the process for burning the CD in 2018? A I don't know how the CDs were burned from the other CDs. I just know that there was nothing retained from the CDs in our system, because I have checked. Q So whatever the process was, it did not leave any residue on the part -- on the Fowler White hard drive? A That is correct. Q But the result was that a copy of the CD was provided to Mr. Link and a copy of the CD was retained by Fowler White in 2018? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: As of the delivery of the copies to Mr. Link's firm, that is correct. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Was there a time when the copy that was retained by Fowler White was also turned over to Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803730 100 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Mr. Link? A Yes. Q When was that? A That was the first week -- beginning of March 2011. Q So how long did Fowler White retain a copy of the CD before -- strike that. When -- after Mr. Link tagged -- flagged the CD for copy and Fowler White made a copy, between that point in time, how long was it that Fowler White retained a copy of that CD before turning the second CD over to Mr. Link? A The copy -- MR. IANNO: Object to form. Between what point in time? BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Between the time that the CD was copied by Fowler White and the time that it was turned over to Mr. Link, what period of time was that? A The copy of the CD was given to Mr. Link's firm, I believe, the 1st of February with the other documents. The file was sent back to our archives on January 27th. It was then retrieved on February 27th -- it might have been January 29th it Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803731 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 went back. It was the last week in January. It was retrieved on February 27th, and I believe the file was picked up on March 1st. Q Did anyone at Fowler White review the contents copy of the CD that Fowler White retained that was entitled "Epstein Bate Stamp". A No. Q Of the -- strike that. While Lilly Ann Sanchez was -- was working as an attorney at Fowler White in 2010 was she a shareholder? A Yes. Q Is the same title true for Joe Ackerman? A I don't know if he was a shareholder in 2010 or not. Q How about Chris Knight? A Yes. Q Is David Tobin still in the same position now that he held then? A I don't know if his title has changed, but his function is the same. Q Did you find any emails between David Tobin and Joe Carney directly? A No. Q Were there any emails between Judge Carney Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803732 1C2 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 and anyone at Fowler White during the year 2012? A I don't know. Q All of the emails that you were able to locate between Fowler White and Judge Carney have been produced? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: All the emails between Fowler White and Judge Carney which referenced the handling of the disc have been produced. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Were there emails between Fowler White and Judge Carney that reference issues other than the handling of the disc that you reviewed? A I believe there were emails regarding the privilege log and how that was to be handled. There were some issues regarding him filing an entry report of some kind that I saw in there. There were matters going on with him for a period of time. I don't know the dates of those. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Any other issues that you remember seeing between Judge Carney and Fowler White? A I'm not sure there were issues between Judge Carney and Fowler White. I just saw on the circulation Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803733 103 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 list where these matters were before Judge Carney and we were on the email chain. Q The three categories, I think you called them, of documents irrelevant, attorneys' eyes only, those were documents that were hard copies received back from Farmer Jaffe by Fowler White, to your knowledge? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. THE WITNESS: That's my understanding. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q And then there were documents logged on a privilege log which were not provided to Fowler White. A That is my understanding. Q And so other than the handling of the CD that we discussed, the other issues that you remember being discussed between Judge Carney and Fowler White related to the filing of the privilege log and the issues dealing with the privilege log and his interim report? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I think there are issues regarding jurisdiction and who was to be hearing the matter going forward. I wasn't paying any attention to the contents because I was focused on trying to see is there any mention regarding the disc or these Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803734 04 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 particular documents. That's what I was looking for. You know, if I happened to see other information while I was reviewing the emails for that, you know, I may have a recollection of it, as I mentioned right now. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Was there anything in Fowler White's possession that you knew was something that was written -- handwritten by Special Master Carney? A I don't recall seeing anything that I knew for sure that was written by Judge Carney. Q Were you ever able to identify the handwriting that was on the copies of the file folder that you received? A No. Q I don't have anything else. MR. SCAROLA: I have a few follow-ups. MR. IANNO: Mr. Link, do you have any questions? MR. LINK: I just have a couple, but I don't mind waiting. MR. SCAROLA: That's okay. Go ahead. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803735 105 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. LINK: Q Mr. Hurley, would you take a look at B7, please, that was marked by Mr. Scarola? If you look at -- take a look at page two, Mr. Hurley, if you would. Maybe you can help me understand -- because we have been talking about a disc that is the subject of this contempt proceeding that had 27,524 pages on it, I believe. If you look at paragraph six, this is a motion that was filed by the firm Farmer, Jaffe, Weissing Edwards, Fistos and Lehrman. It says the trustee has produced to that law firm two discs that contain approximately 74,000 pages. Do you see that? A I do. Q As you sit here, do you know how many pages were on the disc that were delivered by Judge Carney to the Palm Beach office of Fowler White that were sent to the Miami office of Fowler White to be reproduced? A I know that we produced approximately 27,000 pages of documents. Q Do you know if there were -- as you sit here, it says that the corporate rep for Fowler White -- what paragraph six is referring to regarding two CDs which Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803736 106 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 contain approximately 74,000 pages that were produced by the trustee to Farmer Jaffe? A I don't. Q If you look at paragraph seven, there is a third CD that was produced by the trustee to Farmer Jaffe that was corrupted. Do you see that? A I see that. Q If you look at paragraph eight, Farmer Jaffe is making request for additional days to complete a privilege log, because based on the two CDs that were not corrupted and whatever additional pages were on the corrupted CD, they would have at least 74,000 page to review. Do you see that? A I see that. Q Do you have any knowledge as Fowler White's corporate representative that Fowler White received 74,000 pages from the Farmer Jaffe firm? A I do not. MR. LINK: I have no further questions. MR. IANNO: Mr. Scarola. REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When did it first come to Fowler White's attention that it was in possession of a CD that contained information that was subject to restrictions Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803737 107 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 included within the November 10 order? MR. IANNO: Object to form of the question. THE WITNESS: One more time for me, please. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When did it first come to Fowler White's attention that it was in possession of a CD that was subject to the November 10 order of Judge Ray? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. Assumes fact not in evidence, proper hypothetical, argumentive. THE WITNESS: I presume you're talking about after the December 10th, 2010 issues. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yes, sir. A Are we talking about what led to -- Q The contempt proceeding. When did it first come to Fowler White's attention that it possessed a CD in violation of the November 10 order of Judge Ray? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. THE WITNESS: On or about March 8th. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803738 108 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Of what year? A This year. Q How did it come to your attention? A I received a heads-up -- it was either a call or an email from Mr. Link saying that there was an issue with something that was contained in our file that we produced. Q Did Mr. Link or anyone from Link & Rockenbach ever asked Fowler White how it came to be in possession of a CD with allegedly privileged emails on it? MR. IANNO: Object to form. MR. LINK: You can answer yes or no. That's it. THE WITNESS: Yes. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When? MR. IANNO: Just answer when. MR. LINK: Answer when. THE WITNESS: About the same time frame. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Approximately March 8th. A After the initial advice of the issue, yes. Q And was it Mr. Link who raised that issue Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803739 1C9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 with you on approximately March 8th? A I believe so. Q I'm going to request that the package of documents produced by you this morning be marked as Exhibit C. (Exhibit C was marked for identification.) BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Describe to us, if you would please, what is contained within Exhibit C? A Exhibit C contains the materials, that in conjunction with our attorneys, we deem to be in our possession and responsive to the duces tecum part of the notice of today's deposition. Q Are all of these documents documents that were located by you within the business records of Fowler White? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I believe they all came from our file materials. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Is it correct that they have not been changed or altered in any way since they were originally included in the files? A We have not modified anything. MR. IANNO: Long half hour by the way. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803740 110 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 You must be billing by the hour. MR. SCAROLA: It's gonna get a little longer. THE WITNESS: There are a lot of red marks in this file that appear spontaneously. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did Fowler White retain any of the documents that were delivered -- retain copies of any of the documents that were delivered to Link & Rockenbach? MR. IANNO: Object to form. Asked and answered. THE WITNESS: Of the documents in which they asked for hard copies, a copy of those was electronically put into my restricted general counsel file. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did Fowler White retain a copy of any of the discs that were turned over? A No. Q It appears from the documents included within Composite Exhibit C, that, at the time of the delivery of documents to Link & Rockenbach, an inventory was prepared of those documents; is that correct? A The inventory that was mentioned in the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803741 111 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 emails is basically our closed file inventory index with the details removed from that. It's listed by box number, I believe. And that was what was assigned upon delivery. MR. LINK: Let me just make sure I understand. You did not produce to Mr. Scarola an index of documents that I and my staff selected? THE WITNESS: No. MR. LINK: Okay. THE WITNESS: There is no such index. MR. LINK: Okay. I just want to make sure my work product wasn't being shared. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q There were two deliveries to Link & Rockenbach, correct? An initial delivery that consisted of specifically requested documents tabbed by Mr. Link at the time of his first review of the files. A That's correct. Q And then a subsequent request was made for all of Fowler White's Epstein-related files, and a second delivery occurred of all of the files, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: With the exception of -- Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803742 112 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 BY MR. SCAROLA: Q With the exception of correspondence A And billing. Q -- and billing. A Correct. Q And at the time of that second delivery, an inventory was compiled, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: The index from the closed file which listed the various boxes was modified for signature by the courier who was picking up the boxes from our office to reflect box numbers being delivered. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Did that inventory include anything that -- other than the box numbers? A There was no description of what was being delivered other than box numbers. Q Mr. Link requested of you personally the confidentiality agreement that was in effect with respect to this case, correct? A That is correct. Q How did you respond to that request? MR. LINK: You can answer how you responded, not what you responded. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803743 113 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: I'm not sure if I responded in writing or whether I discussed it with him on the phone. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q And what was your response? MR. IANNO: Object to the form. instruct you not to answer. Attorney-client privilege, joint defense work product and outside the scope. Doesn't have anything to do with the chain of custody of the disc. You want to join? MR. LINK: Join. Almost everything you do. MR. EDWARDS: You don't want to carve anything out. MR. LINK: Anything inappropriate I don't join. MR. IANNO: We are on the record here. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q The number of the boxes delivered to Mr. Link was 44. A I didn't count the boxes. Q Let me hand you from Exhibit C this particular page. MR. IANNO: You want to just give him Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803744 11'1 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the Bates number? MR. SCAROLA: Yes. 110. How kind of you. MR. IANNO: Make it simple. That way you don't have to give up your copy. THE WITNESS: The answer to your question is no. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What is the reference to 44 boxes? A That is the total number of boxes in the file, which would have include boxes containing billing records and correspondence. Q Which would lead one to believe that if 36 boxes were delivered to Mr. Link, there were eight boxes of billing records and correspondence? A I believe there were eight boxes of billing records or correspondence, which you're seeing in my office right now. Q Bankers Boxes? A Yes. Not good for the decor. Q There was a second group of documents. Those are the ones there? May I see them? MR. LINK: For the record, these are the documents, Mr. Ianno, that you did not provide me a copy of. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803745 115 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: I don't think they're responsive yet. But I'm happy, if Mr. Scarola wants to deem them responsive, to provide you with a copy and make them part of the production. MR. SCAROLA: I will tell you shortly. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When were the copies in this package made? A I believe yesterday. Q From what were they made? Were they printed from a CD? A No. When I was reviewing areas in my general counsel file to make sure that we had been as inclusive as possible in responding to the duces tecum, I was going through the copy of documents produced that I kept in my file to Mr. Link, the one we referenced a few minutes ago at the time of the January review. And I wanted to look at the -- what was there and see specifically if there was anything in the box where this folder was maintained. And when I opened the copy, I saw that there appears to be other documents that were there as well. The first page was an email from Brad Edwards. There was a Bates stamp on the bottom. I closed the file and picked up the phone and called Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803746 116 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 our lawyers. MR. IANNO: That's it. That's where the documents came from. MR. LINK: Can you help me better understand? Are these -- MR. SCAROLA: How about if he helps me better understand first and maybe that will help you, but let me finish my question. MR. LINK: I can live with that. MR. SCAROLA: Thank you. I appreciate it. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q I don't understand. A When, as I testified earlier, a copy of the hard copies of the documents delivered to Mr. Link's firm were put electronically into my restricted general counsel file. Q You need to stop there for me, okay? Where are these copies coming from? A Our copier center. MR. IANNO: I think he's saying where are the -- the documents were in the file. THE WITNESS: These are documents that were delivered -- that Mr. Link's firm had tagged for production the first time -- Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803747 117 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 after coming to our office the first time in January. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q So there were hard copies -- MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, hang on just one second. So you're sharing with Mr. Scarola documents that I selected that would be part of my work product. Is that -- MR. IANNO: Let's take a break. MR. LINK: I object to that. I don't know what's in there. But anything I put a sticker on is my work product. MR. IANNO: Let's take a break. We have to discuss this. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 1:14 p.m. (A recess was had.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the record. The time is 1:22 p.m. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Could you explain to us, please, the origin of documents Bates stamped FW0000183 through 215? MR. LINK: Before he does that, Mr. Scarola, I would like to see what it is Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803748 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 that we are talking about because of my concern that Fowler White kept a copy of my work product, those documents that I selected for copying, which I was unaware of -- I believe I was unaware of -- and then searched those documents to respond to the subpoena that you issued. So I'm the only who hasn't seen what everybody is talking about, and I would like to -- MR. SCAROLA: No, you're not the only one who hasn't seen them. Pursuant to instruction, I haven't seen then either. And before I agree that they can be turned over to you, I want to know what they are and where they came from. MR. IANNO: So where they came from is Fowler White's files. MR. SCAROLA: Yes. But that doesn't tell me where they came from in order to get into Fowler White's files. MR. IANNO: You can ask him. Do you know where these documents originally came from? THE WITNESS: I have no idea where they Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803749 119 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 came from. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do you know whether any of these documents are documents that were contained on the CD that was turned over to Mr. Link? A I do not know. Q Were these documents documents that were in Fowler White's files in hard copy at the time that the Fowler White files were reviewed by Mr. Link? A I believe they were in our files then. Q So these are copies of what was in Fowler White's files that Mr. Link requested be copied at the time he reviewed those files; is that correct? MR. LINK: Hold on. So this is the work product issue that I'm not waiving. MR. IANNO: We are going to instruct him not to answer based on that. You're getting into the selection process. If they were in the files, he has answered that. MR. LINK: I can stipulate to this, Mr. Scarola, because I'm not trying to hinder what you're doing. I just don't want to share my work product. I will say that every document that we Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803750 120 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 copied and was delivered would have been in the file at the time I looked at it. There was no source other than the documents that Mr. Hurley put in the conference room. Does make sense? BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Looking at these documents, there are approximately 30 pages here. A Okay. Q Mr. Link, by virtue of his own testimony, clearly asked for more than 30 pages to be copied and delivered to him, correct? MR. LINK: That's fine. THE WITNESS: Yes. MR. LINK: Hundreds of pages. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q How did this subset of documents come into existence? From all of those documents that Mr. Link asked to be copied, how did this subset of documents come into existence? MR. IANNO: I'm going to instruct him not to answer, but I will tell you this. Those are documents that we deem may be responsive to your subpoena -- to your notice. That's how they came into Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803751 121 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 existence, because counsel went through and collected documents in order to comply with the notice. Don't make an assumption -- BY MR. SCAROLA: Q How large -- MR. IANNO: Don't make an assumption that -- I will leave it at that. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q How large a volume of documents was reviewed from which these approximately 30 pages were selected? MR. IANNO: Don't answer. That's going to be -- you can answer, generally, how many pages you reviewed to comply with the notice, but not how many you selected of that, because we have another 181 pages that were produced that I didn't have a question on. You can answer generally how many pages you reviewed in preparation for the response to the duces tecum. THE WITNESS: I can't even give you a rough estimate of how many pages I looked at. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What is the distinction between the documents Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803752 122 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 that are a part of Composite Exhibit C and these 30 pages? A Those are documents I saw that had a Bates stamp number on them different and apart from other Bates stamps schemes that we had for documents in the file. It's my understanding -- I have never seen a document printed from the disc. Even though they were not brought to the mediation, I specifically didn't look at them. But I understood they were Bates stamped with consecutive numbers on them. They had no other designation. I saw there was an email on page one from Brad. It had a numbered Bates stamp on the bottom. I then flipped to the next page electronically and saw that also was an email concerning Brad with a Bates stamp, and I closed the folder and I picked up the phone. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, do you mind sharing with me? Are those Bates stamps at the bottom of the documents. MR. SCAROLA: There are two Bates stamps on some of these pages, not all of them. There's an FW Bates stamp, which I assume to be Fowler White. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803753 123 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: That's correct. MR. SCAROLA: And then above that on some of these pages is a second unlettered Bates stamp number. And for the record, those numbers are 03005, 03114, 05111, 05629, 06198, 06577, 07965, 09335. 09336, 10965, 10966, 12291, 19661, 26480, 01686, 02620, 0 -- excuse me -- 10586, 02913, 03082, 05952. An un-Bates stamped page, which is, FW204. MR. IANNO: It is not just a blank page. MR. SCAROLA: It's not a blank page. MR. LINK: I thought they were sequential. They are not sequential? MR. SCAROLA: Oh, no. They are sequential -- the Fowler White numbers are sequential -- MR. LINK: But not the other Bates stamps. MR. SCAROLA: Page 206, no Bates stamp. 207, no other Bates stamp. 208, no other Bates stamp. 209, no other Bates stamp. 210, no other Bates stamp. 211 is 26762, 27494, 05676, 08355, 08420. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803754 24 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 That completes the recitation of the Bates stamped numbers of the documents included in this package. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, do you mind if we ask Mr. Hurley which of the duces tecum items he thought these were responsive to? MR. SCAROLA: No, I don't mind that. MR. IANNO: He's not going to answer. You're not going to get into his mental impression of counsel. MR. SCAROLA: Well, I don't think that that's mental impressions at all. In a request for production, you're required to coordinate the produced materials with the specific item that's requested, and I don't know why it would be any different for a duces tecum. So -- MR. IANNO: Or, in the way they were kept in the ordinary course of business. Mr. Hurley go ahead and answer, if you can. MR. LINK: You have the duces tecum -- THE WITNESS: I understand. They were contained, apparently, in our file at the time that the file was made available for Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803755 125 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 viewing by somebody else. I don't know what those documents are. Again, I haven't looked at them. But I had concerns from what I saw on the top of them. And I thought potentially that might fall under -- I believe it was paragraph six -- dissemination. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What did you see at the top of the documents that alerted you to -- concern about these documents? MR. IANNO: Asked and answered. THE WITNESS: It had Brad Edwards' email up there. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, can you for the record state -- I can see on the first page it says something. What does that say? MR. SCAROLA: It says, J. Carney, dash, Printing of CD Issue. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do you know whose handwriting that is? A I have no idea. Q Was this part of the documents inside some folder? A I have no idea. I saw them electronically. I'm presuming they were. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803756 126 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. LINK: Jack, do you mind if I ask a question, see if we can -- MR. SCAROLA: Go ahead. RECROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. LINK: Q So, do I understand that, in responding to this subpoena duces tecum, sir, by Mr. Scarola, on behalf of Mr. Edwards, that you did a search of the documents that are maintained on your general counsel section of your computer, and that those documents were a set of everything that my law firm asked to be copied? A It is my understanding they were included within those documents. Q Were there other documents contained within the set on the computer that you searched, other than documents which I hand selected? A I'm not sure I understand the question. Q Well, I'm trying to understand if the documents on your computer that you searched were the only documents that were there because I hand selected them, or were there other documents from the files in there as well. A Actually, no. It contained emails from our files. It was -- it was a number of electronic Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803757 127 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 documents. This was a very small subset of everything that was in there. Q No, no. What I'm trying to understand is if the parameters -- the documents you searched included only the documents that we would have put stickers on at the time we reviewed them, or the documents we put stickers on and additional documents from Fowler White's files that you included A It's broader. Q It is much broader. A It's much broader. They were a small part of what I reviewed. FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Are these documents a subset of documents that only included documents reviewed by Mr. Link? MR. IANNO: Object to the form of the question. You can answer. THE WITNESS: The way I located them were within a subsection of those documents. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q The Link-selected documents? A Yes. Q These particular documents were chosen from that subset based upon the fact that they had Brad Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803758 128 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Edwards' name at the top of the documents? A A little bit more than that. Q What more than that? A I saw the cover sheet that is on the first page of that, and saw that that was similar to the cover sheet of the disc that apparently is the source of all of this controversy that had been provided to me earlier, that said Judge Carney - Printing Issue. Then as I opened that, I saw that there were 31 total documents, I believe. And so I looked at the next document to see what the next document was, and that's when I saw Brad Edwards and the Bates stamp. And it was the proximity of the two within what I was looking at that actually made me concerned. So are these documents all of those documents that fell within some subfile labeled Judge Carney Printing of CD Issue? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: That I don't know. They were found together in what I reviewed. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q When you say they were found together, what does that mean? A Again, I'm looking at documents that are Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803759 129 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 electronic. Q Yes, sir. A There is a folder there. The first document of the folder has the first page for you, the Judge Carney - Printing Issues. I open the folder. I see that. I look at the top, I see there are 30 others documents. Turn the page, go flip the page to page two, electronically through the folder. That's when I see the Brad Edwards email and the number at the bottom. I go to page three, I see another Brad Edwards email, number at the bottom. The fact that they were Brad Edwards emails with numbers at the bottom, and the fact that they were in proximity to something which is similar to the folder, I got concerned. Q Did the folder contain any documents other than those documents in the Bates stamp range 183 through 215? A I don't know if those were actually in the folder. The electronic folder -- Q That's my next question. A Okay. Q Did the folder contain anything other than documents in the Bates stamp range 183 through 215? MR. LINK: Object to form. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803760 130 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 THE WITNESS: The folder -- I don't know what was in the folder itself -- the hard folder. If you are talking about the original hard folder, I have no idea, other -- BY MR. SCAROLA: Q I'm talking about the electronic folder that you were reviewing. A The electronic folder that I was reviewing, you have a complete copy of everything that was in it. Q Okay. There was nothing in the folder that is not included in this package. And there is nothing in this package that was not included in the folder; is that correct? MR. LINK: Object to the form. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q This is the entire a copy of that entire folder. A Correct. Q How did this -- how did this folder get created? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Mechanically, I don't know. It was, again, in my general counsel file as being part of the documents which Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803761 I I 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 were copied. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q By Mr. Link -- well, copied at Mr. Link's request? A Yes. Q So this particular folder did not exist until Mr. Link requested documents in 2018? A The electronic folder? Q The electronic folder. A No. Q It did not exist until then? A Absolutely not. Q And you have no idea how all of these documents wound up in the same folder? A I do not. Q Do you know who created the folders? MR. LINK: Are we now talking electronic folder? MR. SCAROLA: Yes. The electronic folder. THE WITNESS: The electronic folders were created by the copy center as they were copying the documents. And they were created and kept together as they were presented for copying. So there is -- Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803762 132 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 whatever -- they received those together and they kept them together. MR. LINK: Can you ask him what he means by they received these together? BY MR. SCAROLA: Q The copy center received groups of documents that were marked by Mr. Link and kept the documents in the same groups in electronic folders. A The documents came from a box. The documents were kept with the boxes at the time of copying. The selected documents were kept. They were put into folders by box number. And this is the entire contents of that particular box number. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, to help you -- I am not going to share what I selected -- but the process was there were 36 boxes or something in there -- and like all production, we put stickies on certain documents for them to copy and left. So the concept that he's describing of folders and things that they created is and I don't know what you're looking at -- but is inconsistent with what we did, so I don't fully understand what he did based on the way we went about putting stickers on Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803763 133 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 various documents. MR. SCAROLA: Is that your handwriting? MR. LINK: No. MR. SCAROLA: Is it your paralegal's or assistant's handwriting? MR. LINK: No. Why would our handwriting be in their file? MR. SCAROLA: Well, it would in their file if you designated for copying a group of documents that you labeled Judge Carney Printing of CD issue. MR. LINK: It's not my handwriting and it's not Tina's. MR. IANNO: Okay. So we're not going to speculate. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do we have any idea where page 0000183 came from? MR. IANNO: You have already asked him. You can answer it again. THE WITNESS: The answer is no. MR. IANNO: There's the answer. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yeah. But there's more. No but what? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803764 134 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I think when I saw it, it looked similar to me as to the folder. That's all I can say as far as that was maintained in our file. Q So were there other folders with similar handwriting on them? A I didn't do that kind of review. Q Well, what do you mean that it is similar to other folders? A What I meant was, the title -- the words on there were similar to the index our closing index, the Judge Carney - Printing Issue. So there was a folder in our file that said Judge Carney - Printing Issue. Q And an indication on the inventory that was prepared back in 2014 that corresponds to this label; is that correct? A Yes. MR. LINK: Not my handwriting. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q And when these documents were turned over to Mr. Link, they were turned over with page 0000183 included in what was turned over to him, correct? A I don't know. I don't know. Q What I thought that you were reviewing were documents that were turned over to Mr. Link. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803765 135 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 A I was reviewing electronic files in my general counsel file that contained those documents. Q Turned over to Mr. Link? A That were copied. Q That were copied for purposes of turning over turning them over to Mr. Link? A That is my understanding, yes. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, you're starting to review them. MR. SCAROLA: Yes, I am. MR. LINK: Let me ask you to pause, please. MR. SCAROLA: I have. How long this time? MR. LINK: I haven't seen them. But my concern is that they have been selected from, obviously, my work product; that they made a copy of -- I was unaware of -- and searched. But I'm still not sure I understand, whatever these documents are, the relevance to the duces tecum and the issue in the contempt proceeding. So if you can if you can tie that you haven't looked at them either -- Can you tie that in for us, Mr. Hurley, Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803766 136 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 so that I understand why you think these particular documents -- because all I've heard you say is they have Brad Edwards' name. I have hundreds of emails with Brad Edwards' name on it that have been produced in this case. I have thousands of pages of documents that have been produced in this case with Bates stamp numbers on them. So based on that description, there's nothing about that that says to me these documents might fit within the subpoena duces tecum. If they do, they do. And I don't have a problem with it. But as I sit here, I am at a loss, because your description doesn't tell me anything more than thousands of documents that I have seen in the normal course of this litigation. MR. IANNO: There is no question, so MR. LINK: I'm just asking why did you pick these versus the thousands that -- MR. EDWARDS: He is asking a question. MR. LINK: How do they get to the subpoena duces tecum? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803767 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: He answered that. Number six. MR. LINK: Can I see number six, please? MR. IANNO: And my suggestion is, if you guys want to fight over this, we will hold them back and you can go -- MR. LINK: I don't think we're fighting. We're trying to understand, at this point. MR. IANNO: Nothing to understand. MR. SCAROLA: Really? MR. IANNO: Yes. He has explained it. MR. SCAROLA: Really? MR. IANNO: Yes. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, you remember what number six says? MR. SCAROLA: That's the one I didn't memorize. MR. LINK: Number six says, "Documents sufficient to identify whether, when, and to whom the subject discs, copies of the subject discs or any data derived from the discs were disseminated." And so I'm trying to understand what it Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803768 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 is about these documents, Mr. Hurley, that you think is responsive to showing that Fowler White -- that these documents demonstrate something about how Fowler White disseminated the disc. MR. IANNO: And he answered that. MR. LINK: He did? MR. IANNO: Yes. MR. LINK: All I heard was, I saw Brad Edwards' name. MR. IANNO: That's one. MR. LINK: And I saw Bates stamps at the bottom. MR. IANNO: That's two. And the file folder -- and the word -- asked and answered. MR. LINK: The first page, it says, Judge Carney. MR. IANNO: Right. You can ask him if there's anything else other those three, because that's what he's already testified to. MR. LINK: Mr. Scarola, I would suggest this. Why don't we mark it. Why don't you and I look at it together with an agreement Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803769 139 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 that whatever is in there won't be a waiver of my work product or any -- if -- maybe these are attorney-client or work product of Mr. Edwards' that we're fighting about -- I won't use that as an additional waiver argument. So at least we know what we are talking about. MR. SCAROLA: I can't agree to that until I look at them. MR. LINK: But I can't let you look at them without my looking at them because I have my own work product. MR. SCAROLA: I will agree that my looking at them is not a waiver of your work product. MR. LINK: Generous of you, but I think we have to look at them together or give them back and then we can go to Judge Ray and see what Judge Ray says. MR. EDWARDS: But these are all documents that you got, so presumably you have them. MR. SCAROLA: And you still have them. MR. EDWARDS: You still have them. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803770 140 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. SCAROLA: And you have the numbers. MR. LINK: I probably do. But I don't want to have turned them over and have them part of this as a waiver of my work product. MR. SCAROLA: Yes, sir. And that's what I'm agreeing will not be argued. We all have them -- MR. LINK: But I wanted to see -- MR. SCAROLA: It's not a waiver of your work product. MR. LINK: I got it. But I wanted to see what they are, because, obviously, it's a selection of documents that I made. I don't know what they are. So my offer still stands. MR. EDWARDS: Do we know whether these are documents from the privilege log? MR. LINK: He couldn't know. Nobody has looked at them. MR. EDWARDS: I know. But we have a privilege log that has Bates numbers on here. We have documents that have Bates numbers on them. Has anybody looked at the Bates numbers, not the contents of the documents, but the Bates numbers to match Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803771 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 the Bates numbers? MR. IANNO: We have not. THE WITNESS: Joe, let's talk for a second. MR. LINK: I don't think anybody has done anything. The other issue with that, Brad, is THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 1:50 p.m. (A discussion was held off the record.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the record. The time is 1:51 p.m. MR. SCAROLA: We have just been informed that some of the documents included within the still-unmarked composite labeled "J. Carney-Printing of CD Issue," based upon the Bates stamp numbers, are documents that appear on the Farmer Jaffe/Brad Edwards privilege log, correct? MR. IANNO: He doesn't know that. MR. SCAROLA: You know that, Mr. Ianno. MR. IANNO: No. We know that because -- I don't know that personally, but that's my understanding, is that we checked, and that some of those do. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803772 142 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Mr. Hurley, specifically, did not do that to avoid knowing any of the contents of those documents. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Do we have any idea of how hard copies of privilege log documents were contained within the Fowler White files in 2018? A No. Q Do you agree that they shouldn't have been in there? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: Without knowing how they came to us, the answer is I'm not sure I can answer that. MR. SCAROLA: Let's you and I talk a moment. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 1:53 p.m. (A recess was had.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the record. The time is 2 p.m. MR. SCAROLA: The parties have agreed that review of the documents that will be marked as Exhibit D to this deposition will not constitute a waiver of either Mr. Link's Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803773 143 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 work product privilege or any privilege asserted by Brad Edwards or Farmer Jaffe over the documents themselves. We will also agree that this exhibit be sealed and neither we nor you, Mr. Link, will retain a copy of this exhibit. We will review it here. We won't retain a copy. MR. LINK: I agree with that. MR. SCAROLA: You got it. MR. EDWARDS: So we are going to mark that as -- it's a sealed attached -- MR. SCAROLA: We are going to mark this as sealed attached exhibit. We have made two copies to facilitate our looking through it, but we are going to turn the copy -- the sealed copy over to the court reporter, and the other copy goes to you to be shredded. And you will be held in contempt if we find that you've retained a copy of the copy. (Exhibit D was marked for identification.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The times is 2:02 p.m. (A recess was had.) THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going back on the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803774 144 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 record. The time is 2:15 p.m. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q We have had an opportunity to review the contents of Exhibit D, which will be a sealed exhibit to this deposition. And I just want to confirm that Exhibit D is a copy of hard-copied documents that were in Fowler White's file as of the time that that file was inventoried in 2014, as far as you have been able to determine, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: I have no way of telling that. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Well, do you have any reason to believe that anything was added to Fowler White's files between the time that it was inventoried in 2014 and the time that it was reviewed by Mr. Link? A I have no way of answering that one way or the other. Q Does Fowler White know of any circumstances that would have resulted in the addition of documents to Fowler White's files subsequent to the time the files were inventoried in 2014? A I'm not aware of any. Q What was the purpose of inventorying the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803775 45 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 files in 2014? A The inventory of files in 2014 was so that we knew which folders were in the file at the time it was being closed. It doesn't describe the contents of the folders. Q I understand that. But Fowler White was closing its files because it had concluded its representation of Jeffrey Epstein as of that time, correct? A Correct. Q So as far as Fowler White knows, since it had concluded its representation of Jeffrey Epstein and was closing its files and inventorying the files for purposes of closing them, there would have been no reason to be adding to those files after they were closed, correct? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: That would be speculating one way or the other. I don't know. I don't know of any reason why things would be put in. I don't know if we received anything afterwards that would have been put in the file. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q What is the closing process? How does that Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803776 146 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 occur? A The file clerk prepares an inventory in the database, boxes are assigned; it is sent to archives, sometimes retrieved from archives, then sent back to archives; then left in archives and destroyed after a certain period of time. Q What does it mean to be sent to archives? A It is sent to an off-site facility, which specializes in the storage of files. Q When requests are made to retrieve files from the archives, are those requests documented? A Yes. Q Did you see any request to retrieve this file from archives at any time between 2014 when it was initially archived and 2018 when the file was provided to Mr. Link for his review? A It actually went to archives in early 2015, I believe. And I requested the file back in November of 2017. Q Okay. Was there any other requests to remove the file from inventory -- from archive between those dates? A No. Q The file that is printed as part of Exhibit D or Exhibit D, which is a copy of the file labeled "J. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803777 147 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Carney Printing of CD Issue," that file is on the 2014 inventory, right? A There's a lot in that question, again. The file folder -- the name of the file folder appears on the inventory. It doesn't reflect the contents of the folder. It doesn't necessarily mean that everything as is presented for copying was as it was contained at the time the file was sent to archives. Q So somebody could have snuck into wherever these files are archived, inserted new documents in the file without ever requesting the file from archives, so that new documents would have been in that file, inserted sometime between 2014 and 2017? A And that's not at all what I said. Q Pardon me? A That's not what I said. Q Well, can you think of any other explanation as to how new documents would get into that file between the time it was inventoried in 2014 and the time you requested it from archives in 2017? A I don't believe that documents were put in the file during the time of the archives. I don't know if anything was added to the file before going to archives. I don't know if anything was added to the Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803778 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 file coming back. I'm not trying to say it was done surreptitiously in any way. But there are times -- it would not be reflected in the index or inventory if anything as added to the file. Q How does something get added to file after it has been inventoried and archived, unless it's pulled out of the archive to put something new in? MR. IANNO: Object to form. THE WITNESS: And I just said it would not have been done when it was archived. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q So are you saying that maybe sometime between the time it was inventoried and got sent to archive that something could have been put in there? MR. IANNO: Object to form. That's not what he's saying. MR. SCAROLA: That's what I'm trying to find out. I'm sure he's capable of telling us. THE WITNESS: First of all, I'm not saying that what you have mark as Exhibit D was all contained together in the file as it was inventoried and sent to archives. It may have been in the file and other parts. Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803779 149 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 I don't know. I don't know if it was added before it was sent to archives. I don't know if it was added after it came from archives. I have no indication it was added any time after archives. But I don't know when those documents were put into the file, nor can I tell you where for sure they were maintained in the file once they were in the file. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Mr. Hurley, let me be entirely clear with you as to what I'm trying to figure out. We have looked at Exhibit D. Exhibit D contains one or more documents that were included on the privilege log, documents that have been on the privilege log since the time the privilege log was prepared, and documents that were never voluntarily turned over to anyone. We're trying to figure out how a hard copy of a privileged document could have been included in Fowler White's files when Fowler White gave access to those files to Mr. Link. MR. IANNO: Object to the form. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Can you offer us any explanation as to that? Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803780 150 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 MR. IANNO: You can ask him if he knows and I don't have any objection to that question of how the documents got in there. But I want to absolutely my clear you're asking him to speculate. MR. SCAROLA: No. I'm asking him to offer us any explanation he can as to how Fowler White winds up in possession of a hard copy of a privileged document that it was not supposed to have. MR. IANNO: Then you're asking him to speculate. You can ask him if he knows. And then if you want to follow up, that's fine. But other than that, it calls for speculation. BY MR. SCAROLA: Q Yeah. That's my question. Do you know how a hard copy of a privileged document could have wound up in Fowler White's files when those files were turned over to Mr. Link for inspection? A I do not. RECROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Do you know when the hard copies that are Composite Exhibit D -- do you have any idea when those Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803781 I I 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 documents came into possession of Fowler White? A I do not. Q The cover that says, "J. Carney Printing of CD Issue," that's the verbiage that was on the inventory that you're speaking about? A That is similar to the verbiage on the inventory, which was the title of the file folder. Q When you say it's similar to it, is it identical to? A I think it's identical. Q Do you believe that what we have as the first page which is Bates numbered 183 in this Composite Exhibit D -- is a copy of what is on the file folder that was inventoried in 2014? A I do. Q Why do you believe that? A Because I think our servers made a copy of the folder with the writing on it to identify it. Q Do you believe that within that folder back in 2014 was this compilation of documents in the order this compilation of documents is presented today back in 2014? MR. IANNO: Object to form. You're asking him to speculate. If you're asking, as Mr. Scarola did, Do you know, I don't Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803782 12 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 have an objection to that question. THE WITNESS: And I do not know. BY MR. EDWARDS: Q Do you know whether this compilation of documents became this compilation in this order only after Mr. Link went to Fowler White, or was it already in this order? A I do not know. MR. EDWARDS: All right. MR. IANNO: We will read. THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Going off the record. The time is 2:26 p.m. This marks the end of the deposition. MR. LINK: I am handing to Mr. Ianno my copy of Exhibit D as part of the agreement that Mr. Scarola put on the record. I have no copies of that document. MR. IANNO: To be shredded. - - - (The deposition was concluded at 2:29 p.m.) Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803783 1 5 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CERTIFICATE OF OATH STATE OF FLORIDA : SS COUNTY OF PALM BEACH ) I, the undersigned authority, certify that JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE personally appeared before me and was duly sworn. WITNESS my hand and official seal this 22nd day of October, 2018. Sonja D. Hall Commission No.: GG 168652 Notary Public - State of Florida My Commission Expires: 2-01-22 Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803784 154 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 REPORTER'S DEPOSITION CERTIFICATE STATE OF FLORIDA ) : SS COUNTY OF PALM BEACH ) I, SONJA D. HALL, certify that I was authorized to and did stenographically report the deposition of JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE; that a review of the transcript was requested; and that the transcript is a true and complete record of my stenographic notes. I further certify that on the 22nd day of October, 2018, I notified JOSEPH IANNO, ESQUIRE that the deposition of JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE was ready for reading and signing by the witness. I further certify that I am not a relative, employee, attorney, or counsel of any of the parties, nor am I a relative or employee of any of the parties' attorney or counsel connected with the action, nor am I financially interested in the action. Dated this 22nd day of October, 2018. SONJA D. HALL Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803785 1 55 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 TO: JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE c/o JOSEPH IANNO, ESQUIRE CARLTON FIELDS, PA 525 Okeechobee Boulevard, Suite 1200 West Palm Beach, FL 33401 RE: ROTHSTEIN ROSENFELDT ADLER, P.A. At the conclusion of your deposition given in the above-styled cause you indicated you wished to read and sign the transcript. This letter is to advise you that your deposition is ready, and we ask that you call our office at (561) 471-2995 at your earliest convenience for an appointment to come in. If you are a party in this action and your attorney has ordered a copy of this transcript, you may wish to read his copy and forward to us a photostatic copy of your signed correction sheet. It is necessary that you do this as soon as possible, since the transcript cannot be held beyond two weeks from the date of this letter. If you have any reason which you would like for me to place on your deposition as to your failure to sign the same, please advise. Thank you for your prompt attention. Very truly yours, PALM BEACH REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 1665 Palm Beach Lakes Blvd., Suite 1001 West Palm Beach, Florida 33401 BY: SONJA D. HALL Date: October 22nd, 2018 Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803786 1 56 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 CORRECTION SHEET: NAME: JAMES N. HURLEY, ESQUIRE RE: ROTHSTEIN ROSENFELDT ADLER, P.A. The following corrections, additions or deletions were noted on the transcript of the testimony which I gave in the above-captioned matter held on October 19th, 2018: PAGE(S) LINE(S) SHOULD READ SIGNATURE: DATE: Palm Beach Reporting Service, Inc. 561-471-2995 EFTA00803787